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New transport: innovations, engines, pollution, technologies, policies, organization ...The hydrogen car RE: The future?

Transport and new transport: energy, pollution, engine innovations, concept car, hybrid vehicles, prototypes, pollution control, emission standards, tax. not individual transport modes: transport, organization, carsharing or carpooling. Transport without or with less oil.
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chatelot16
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Re: RE hydrogen car: the future?

Unread Messageby chatelot16 » 20/04/18, 19:46

when eric dupont will explain the cost of his liquid nitrogen machine we can compare with the fuel cell

the fuel cell exists ... we can see the price of what is available ... I find the fuel cell too expensive for me, but it is usable for some since it exists

if eric dupont invented a cost-effective cold engine it would also be profitable to use hydrogen in liquid form ... by making energy with both its cold and its fuel quality

alas, I am afraid that the energetic valorization of the cold is too heavy and too expensive to be put in a vehicle!

if the energetic valorization of the cold of a liquefied gas must have a first use it will be for the gasification of the methane in the ports or one receives methane liquid by the methanier ... so much that it does not do in this case or it's the least difficult it will not be done in a vehicle!

there is another energy which is forgotten in hydrogen: in the case where it is stored compressed at 200 or 300 bar: the energy of the compressed gas! instead of stretching stupidly in a pressure regulator, if one relaxes in a compressed gas engine one gains a not negligible power, of the order of 10% of the power supplied by the hydrogen like fuel ... and a gas engine tablet is quite simple

a compressed air only engine has difficulty finding the necessary heat in the ambient air so as not to cool too much and lose its efficiency ... a compressed gas engine that powers a heat engine or a fuel cell does not have this problem because it takes advantage of the lost heat of this engine

such a use of the energy of the compressed gas makes it possible to compensate for part of the gas compression expenditure
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Eric DUPONT
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Re: RE hydrogen car: the future?

Unread Messageby Eric DUPONT » 21/04/18, 08:40

the cost of a liquid nitrogen engine with nitrogen reheating with hydrogen is as follows. a two-stage 300 bar motor and 20 bar are required to release the compressed nitrogen which has been heated to 500 ° C. An exchanger for heating the nitrogen to 500 ° C with the fuel. An exchanger for heating liquid nitrogen with compressed nitrogen coming out of the engine. a small compressor has 300 bar to compress the cold nitrogen coming out of the exchanger.

Compared to an engine where it is the water that heats the nitrogen, with the fuel, the engine is simpler because there is no water to recover and reheat, the exchanger to reheat the nitrogen Liquid as well as the compressor for compressing the cold nitrogen are smaller since the consumption of liquid nitrogen is less important.

it is not useful with the hydrogen to recover the energy of the expansion of the hydrogen, in a way we can not recover the cold of the relaxation to cool the nitrogen which leaves the engine and which will pass in the exchanger before the compression.

For liquid hydrogen in a vehicle, it's better not to think about it


the problem is not the cost of the nitrogen engine, which is probably less expensive than the fuel cell and is more expensive than a heat engine, but it is the cost of hydrogen at the pump that is plaguing the budjet. at the limit we can replace the hydrogen with Ch4.
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