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New transport: innovations, engines, pollution, technologies, policies, organization ...Hyperloop the train of the future?

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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby moinsdewatt » 13/05/16, 20:31

Christophe wrote:Exact and what do the Japanese think? Because they are the only ones (I think) to have a magnetic train that rolls every day in the world ... although I think the Russians have one too ...



The Japanese MAGLEV:
The SCMaglev1, also known as JR-Maglev, is a magnetic levitation train developed from 1962 by Japan Rail. Its first commercial version is to link Tokyo and Nagoya in 2027. If you consider that a train does not necessarily roll on rails, then we can say that it is the fastest train in the world, able to reach 603 km / h since April 2015.

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCMaglev
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby Christophe » 13/05/16, 22:19

Thank you but all this does not give us the figures on energy or power needed ... lift and propulsion ... history to compare the total to a train or even a classic airplane ...

Also the magnetic field of this technology must be immense, not sure that it is harmless for the passengers ... finally especially the employees ...
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby sen-no-sen » 13/05/16, 22:49

Christophe wrote:Thank you but all this does not give us the figures on energy or power needed ... lift and propulsion ... history to compare the total to a train or even a classic airplane ...

Also the magnetic field of this technology must be immense, not sure that it is harmless for the passengers ... finally especially the employees ...



Image

Below is a comparison between ICE(german tgv) and the Transrapid(magnetic levitation train).
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby Christophe » 14/05/16, 12:04

So thank you magnetic levitation is more interesting visibly ... but it would be interesting to have the necessary% to the sustenance

On the other hand 22 Wh / km.passager it seems to me a very low value! An electric car consumes 150 at 250 Wh / km.passager is about 10 times more ... and never reaches 200 km / h ...

Converting this value to L / 100 km car equivalent (0.3 yield) gives: (2.2 kWh / 0.3) = 7.3 kWh "fuel" or 0.7 L / 100 km.passenger to 200 km / h ...
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby Christophe » 14/05/16, 12:28

Well I took the 2 figures that had been found in the other subject: new-transport / transit-vacuum-the-key-of-transportation-long distance-t9963-60.html # p303215

a) 170 Traveler.km/Kep
et
b) 50 passenger.km/L (at 300km / h)

1 kep = 11.6 kWh
1 L = 10 kWh

We get in the same unit:
a) 70 Wh / km.passager
b) 200 Wh / km.passager

That's quite a difference with the 34 Wh / km.passager ...
The case a) remains in the same order of magnitude and it is the only one to specify a little the method: filling rate and primary energy ...
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby nrj974 » 21/10/16, 10:37

Hyperloop? I just ask myself some "minor" technical questions very "basic":

Can someone explain to me how:

1) Are you planning on taking any "small" turn to a hyperloop transport of> 10 Tonnes launched at 1200 km / h?
2) Can we compensate for the expansion of tubes hundreds of miles long?
3) Pass a propulsive magnetic field through metal tubes?
4) If tubes type "plastic", how to compensate the expansion / temperature / diameter deviations?
5) Realize seals holding such characteristics (diameter, Delta pressure, Delta T, ...)
6) Make an infrastructure "economical" Vs LGV given the mass of material needed for vacuum tubes (thickness> 30mm!)
7) Compensate for a (unavoidable) failure of levitation motors (wheels / pads holding at 1200 km / h?)
8) Compensate for variations in electrical production of PV panels? (hyper mega batteries powerful / polluting?)
9) Compensate ground level deviations (J / N dilation, hygrometry, rain, drought, lunar attraction, Delta T, Delta P, ...)
10) Compensate for misalignment (abutment of pillars, ground movements, settlement, expansion of supports, wind, ...)
Etc. ..

PS: I have a little fun ... I'm just surprised the craze for a project not based on any serious scientific foundation or in-depth study, proto, demonstrator, driver, or ... !
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby nrj974 » 21/10/16, 11:25

Sorry, I was a little fast for the 3 and 4 questions, the engines being built into the tube obviously.

On the other hand, the peak power being 51 MW (anyway), how to dissipate the residual heat in the vacuum?
Etc ... full of unanswered questions ...
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby sen-no-sen » 21/10/16, 12:04

nrj974 wrote:Hyperloop? I just ask myself some "minor" technical questions very "basic":

Can someone explain to me how:

1) Are you planning on taking any "small" turn to a hyperloop transport of> 10 Tonnes launched at 1200 km / h?


The principle will be simple: no cornering, the straight line as for the TGV, and as for the last one, if there is a bend then there will be a decrease of speed as any type of vehicle faces. this kind of situation.

2) Can we compensate for the expansion of tubes hundreds of miles long?

The current oil and gas pipelines, which are several hundreds to thousands of kilometers long, are relatively watertight, it is a well-controlled technology, in the case of hyperloop, because it is impossible to install a zigzag path (as is the case with pipelines). not buried in fault areas) there will certainly be bellows or shock absorber systems.

I'm just amazed at the craze on a project with no sound scientific basis no thorough study, proto, demonstrator, pilot, or ...

Hyperloop it's new with old, the project dates back to the 70 years.
There is an earlier project on Swissmetro.
Could you explain no serious scientific basis?? : Frown:
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby sen-no-sen » 21/07/18, 20:42

Hyperloop, the shallot race reaches China

HTT has announced that it has signed a contract in China for the construction of a line of 10 kilometers. But the Chinese have already announced a running 1 500 km / h test from 2021.

While China has committed to reducing its infrastructure spending to reduce its debt, two projects have been announced in recent weeks. The latest is from the US company Hyperloop Transportation Technologies (HTT) which "announces the signing of a trade agreement in the People's Republic of China." The agreement was signed by both HyperloopTT and the Chinese group Tongren Transportation & Tourism Investment: This agreement represents the first Hyperloop project launch in China, and for HyperloopTT, this agreement marks the twelfth development project being carried out and the third for a commercial line after those signed this year with Abu Dhabi and Ukraine. "

Indeed, HTT is building a commercial line of 10 km in Abu Dhabi and hopes to open the first segment in 2020. It also seduced the elected officials of Occitanie to be able to install in Toulouse-Francazal (Haute-Garonne) its research and development center, as well as a test track. Dirk Ahlborn, CEO of HTT, already sees Hyperloop play a vital role on the Silk Road.



No information on route and date of commissioning

Problem, this new project seems very vague. We do not know anything about the layout of this future line, nor its date of marketing. And what can we really say about commercial lines of 10 kilometers, while this mode of transport composed of pressurized capsules circulating in a vacuum tube is supposed to advance at a speed of 1 000 to 1 200 km / h. Admittedly, no one has yet driven at 400 km / h, but what can such a short line be used for? Today, there are comfortable, fast and safe means of transport for this type of need.


China versus United States

In any case, this announcement comes weeks after the publication of the Chinese Science and Technology Daily, 20, last June, which indicated that the southwest Jiatong University in Chengdu (Sichuan) was developing a platform train test that will allow trains to run at 1 500 km / h.

It also indicated that the tests would begin in April 2021, a very precise date unlike the project Hyperloop initiated several years ago by Elon Musk, the billionaire at the head of Tesla. In this article, a professor from Shanghai Tongji University, Sun Zhang, translates the Chinese desire to beat his American rival in the race for speed. "Mr. Musk downplayed the importance of the Chinese high-speed train by introducing a high-speed line concept that can reach a speed of 1 200 km / h ... China has now responded to this call by announcing a line capable of reach the 1 500 km / h. " Or how to transport the China-United States trade war on the railway field ...


https://www.usinenouvelle.com/article/hyperloop-la-course-a-l-echalote-atteint-la-chine.N722589
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Re: Hyperloop the train of the future?

Unread Messageby Leo Maximus » 24/07/18, 23:22

Records broken at the annual Hyperloop competition at Space X headquarters in California:

https://www.letemps.ch/sciences/record- ... rain-futur

https://www.futura-sciences.com/tech/ac ... ord-66167/

https://trustmyscience.com/hyperloop-re ... allemands/

Just a note: these are models on wheels and there is no one on board.

But it is a great progress compared to the famous Swissmetro which has never worked in a digital model. : Cheesy:
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