Lithium battery and ecology: CO2, life cycle, eco-balance study

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Lithium battery and ecology: CO2, life cycle, eco-balance study




by Christophe » 08/08/17, 14:34

It has been a long time since the question of the eco-balance (at least on the CO2) Lithium batteries ... here (finally) a Swedish study that answers the question and the figures are ... frankly not very good!

Example with the latest Tesla Model 3.

It has a battery of 80kWh is 80 * 150 = 12 000 kg of CO2 just for the manufacture ... It is the equivalent of 100 000 km of emission for a thermal car to 120 gr / CO2.km ...

Obviously the manufacture of the thermal car also emits CO2 ... but the electricity, unless it comes from a source 100% renewable, is not neutral in CO2 either ... In short it is not won the friends!

But it's not just CO2 in life (an electric car does not emit lethal fine particles, for example) and it's easier to produce green electricity than bio-refinery ...

See also the study of the ADEME of 2013 (quoted in the article below and which has quite different figures): Transportation-electric / Ecobilan-global-ademe-of-the-car-electric-vs-thermal-t13331.html

The Swedish Agency for Research and the Environment has made an interesting assessment of the environmental cost of producing lithium-ion batteries. It indicates several axes of improvement.

The Swedish Research and Environment Agency (IVL) has relied on more than 40 international research studies to take stock of the controversial production of lithium-ion batteries. In addition to the details, the agency offers several areas for improvement.

A controversy

This aspect of the production - or rather the cost - of batteries is one of the clashes between "pro" and "anti" electric cars. Because if it is clear that the electric car has more advantages than some during the phase of use (emissions of CO2, emissions of particles and atmospheric pollutants and noise), it is necessary to take the entirety of the imprint ecological, including the recycling phase (which is not taken into account here).

150 to 200 kilograms of CO2 per kWh

"Electric and hybrid cars have major advantages over petrol and diesel vehicles, particularly with regard to local emissions and noise levels. But it is also important to evaluate the entire picture and minimize the environmental impact at the production stage, "emphasizes Lisbeth Dahllöf, a researcher at IVL. According to the authors' compilations, each kWh of batteries produced would generate the equivalent of 150 to 200 kilos of CO2 in the atmosphere, a figure that is based on the global energy (production) mix still predominantly held by fossil fuels (from 50 at 70% of electricity produced).

Between 5 and 17 tons for a battery

According to this estimate, the production of a battery of 30 kWh would then turn around 5 tons whereas that of a Tesla 100 kWh would exceed 17 tons. This puts us far from the figures provided by ADEME (Public Agency for the Environment and Energy Management in France) in 2013 which gave 9 tons of CO2 for an electric vehicle and 22 tons for a thermal but with the accuracy of basing its calculation on the complete life cycle of the car (production, use, recycling), projection which necessarily offsets the emissions from this phase of production during use, or even recycling because the batteries can be reused (see below).

Everything depends on the source

That said, the study indicates that CO2's emission volumes can be very different depending on the reality of each country. Because the origin of the energy production can be responsible up to 70% of these emissions. Example: if we take into account how to produce electricity in Sweden - and therefore the estimate that 162 kWh of electricity is needed to produce 1 kWh of battery - the carbon impact could be lower by more than 60 % thanks to 58% of renewable energy production for 42% of nuclear shares.

The progress of the industry

The authors are also convinced that the carbon impact would be even more limited thanks to the progress that manufacturers can make, for example by placing solar panels on the roofs of factories, as is the case with Tesla. "For a sustainable future, it is important that the production of electric car batteries is as energy efficient as possible and produced with electricity that is totally or very carbon-free," says the study. It also invites the authorities to require manufacturers to publish figures on the "global" emissions of their models to better inform the consumer.

The impact of the consumer

The IVL study finally indicates that consumers also have their share of responsibility and that they could also reduce the CO2 impact of battery production by better measuring their needs. Indeed, the "range anxiety" or fear of running out of fuel pulls the production of large batteries upwards when this is not necessarily necessary. Supply and use should therefore be better segmented in order to produce as efficiently as possible. In short, it is therefore above all necessary to think of the evolution in a global way, knowing for example that the batteries of our electric cars will be able to experience a second life in our homes as an area for storing electricity when it is the most available or surplus during the day. We could thus use a battery for 30 or 40 years knowing that in the meantime, progress in recycling will have greatly evolved. The future must be thought about now, but in a necessary globality, which our leaders do not seem to understand at all, very unfortunately.


Source: https://www.moniteurautomobile.be/actu- ... ction.html

Download the study: http://www.ivl.se/english/startpage/top ... ction.html

Direct pdf:
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by lilian07 » 08/08/17, 23:13

Yes 100 000 km is not nothing but to return to Tesla are plan to reduce the gray energy produced by the VE is wider.
The first phase ends:
phase 1: make the EV profitable by offering a high-end vehicle (the model S and X) able to compete with high-end thermal vehicles which allows to integrate a lot of battery (3 / 4 price of VE) and to reach 600 km of autonomy. At the same time having a company capable of doubling the global production of Li-ion battery to optimize the costs and therefore the gray energy to the production. Sa Gigafactory should reduce the energy requirement by 2 (its roof is realized in solar panel and it is the largest company in the world in front of Boeing hangars ...)
His model S is the vehicle that has the best coefficient of penetration and reduces its Cx drastically.
The integration of the self-driving vehicle must allow better management of the road flow and the low consumption driving.
The purchase of the solarCity company to launch the mass production of solar panels special roofing habitat.
The realization of a housing storage module based on Li-Ion battery (16 Kwh)
The multiplication of fast charging stations to increase the autonomy of EVs.

Phase 2: Reducing production costs and batteries makes it possible to reach mass production vehicles of the middle class by offering more cost-effective prices than a diesel vehicle, which reduces costs and optimizes the extraction process This is the model 3 launched 15 days ago.

Phase 3: The EV is available to everyone as a "vélib" on Tesla terminals which are becoming very numerous. The solar roof of the habitat makes it possible to achieve total autonomy (displacement and need of the habitat) and the renewable energies can become preponderant in a world less constrained by the harmfulness of CO2 and the particles.

Phase 4: Transport becomes fast on major roads (Hyperloop 1000 km / h travels in capsules and vacuum tubes as for the capsule of currency in the hypermarket ...). Colonization of the planet Mars by a reusable less expensive launcher and by the control of the artificial intelligence which will then allow to make any movement without risk and 100% autonomous with the least possible energy ...

We will probably be at the 4 stage in 2050 ... 2060 but it's not so far away ...
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by dirk pitt » 09/08/17, 07:32

Christophe wrote:
It has a battery of 80kWh is 80 * 150 = 12 000 kg of CO2 just for the manufacture ... It is the equivalent of 100 000 km of emission for a thermal car to 120 gr / CO2.km ...


pity, do not compare a gray energy manufacturing on one side to an energy use. it just helps put doubt in the minds of many.
if you want to make a comparison: compare the manufacturing energy of the tesla to the manufacturing energy of a thermal.
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by Christophe » 09/08/17, 10:39

It was the first comparison that came to my mind because it is easy (we are talking about gray CO2 and not gray energy ... ok they are proportional) ... and I put flats after ...

But at the level of gray energy of a thermal, where are we exactly? I have in mind 40 000 60 000 km equivalent ...

ps: an electric car is not just his battery, so if these figures are realistic, it's a safe bet that an electric car is much more CO2 and gray energy than a thermal car. ..good after ... without paranoia none ... we know the power of oil in the world so ... we may be facing a mobile type study funded by operators : Mrgreen: : Cry:
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by ENERC » 10/08/17, 17:04

I have more confidence in the UCS study that has been reviewed by automakers like Nissan and uses data from the Argonne lab: http://www.ucsusa.org/sites/default/fil ... report.pdf

An electric vehicle with 130 km autonomy requires one tonne of CO2 more than a gasoline vehicle, 15% more.

The price of batteries drops by 15% per year, which means that the CO2 balance sheet also improves every year (there is a relationship between the manufacturing cost and the amount of energy consumed).
It's like photovoltaics: the initial assessment was not very good, but it quickly improved.

One ton of CO2 is about 10 000 km, and not 100 000 as in the IVL study which is based on old data (up to 2009) and average averages. Given the evolution of technology, they should have taken the minimum values ​​of each publication used. And ask the builders their numbers ....
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by chatelot16 » 10/08/17, 19:56

it's worse than that! when you want to settle for an old used car its gray energy is practically zero since I buy cars almost good for scrap ... if we do not buy it disappear!
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by chatelot16 » 10/08/17, 20:05

Christophe wrote:But it's not just CO2 in life (an electric car does not emit lethal fine particles, for example) and it's easier to produce green electricity than bio-refinery ...

on the contrary ... I can manufacture electricity with photovoltaics, but EDF does not want it without cost of instalation exessive ... so it serves no purpose except what I can autoconsommer ... and I n do not even try to store in batteries the batteries of the current trade are too expensive to be profitable

on the other hand, when I pass wood in a stationary gazogene, I distill a little methanol and acetone that can be mixed with gasoline to serve as fuel: no false expenses and assured profitability

if all the wood-fired boilers for heating were replaced by good gas-generators, a huge quantity of cheap liquid fuel would be produced.

maybe the complexity is not acceptable for everyone: we could therefore prefer thermal power plants wood, multifunction, heating, electricity and liquid fuel production
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by lilian07 » 10/08/17, 21:10

The price The Li-ion batteries will have been divided by 2 by 2020 is the need in gray energy in proportion.
It is also very likely that the mass density will always double with the same technology and always at the same time.
A little unknown, however, is the global lithium production capacity that risks putting sand in the wheels of this factor 4 that will allow the VE a range greater than 1000 km.
It is true that the best is the reuse of cars to the end to make negligible the cost of CO2 to produce the vehicle but there is always CO2 to roll this vehicle that sometimes consumes much more than a recent vehicle .
Today, car manufacturers know how to run 100 horsepower vehicles that consume 3.4 l / 100 km, which makes it obsolete to switch to hybrids and full hybrids.
The interest remains on the 100% electric knowing that this type of vehicle will be much more durable than a thermal vehicle that runs out and wears to want to turn a wheel with a yield of 25%, the others 75% being only heat, friction and noise ....
For a self installer PV no doubt that the problem with EDF will disappear quickly ...
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Re: Lithium, CO2 and life cycle batteries: an eco-balance study!




by chatelot16 » 10/08/17, 21:46

we have illusions about the progress in lower consumption of gasoline cars ... I saw my old citroen gs and gsa reduce their consumption in the same proportion as the recent car simply because there is 20 years I was driving at 150 km / h as long as I could and that 10 years later I was driving much more slowly

Conversely, I see many people who are dragging modern cars that operate in degraded mode with a capped kakalytic pot or an electronic bazaar broken down and which consume miserably and do not have the financial means to pay for the repair.

with my old car it was easy to keep them in good condition without breaking the bank

I went back the classic ignition of the GS GSA because all the electronic ignition of the GSA deconsed ... well the classic marschal alumage deconnaient also ... it is the oldest of my GS a ducalier who has passed several GSA without weakening
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