Electricity: to pay to sell ????

[Did67]

Article published on the website of the newspaper Le Monde today:

Pay to sell. If this seems absurd, it is not uncommon. Unaccustomed to this phenomenon, France is in turn caught up by negative electricity prices on the wholesale markets.

Sunday, the megawatt hour (MWh) was traded at a negative price of - 40,99 euros on the Electricity Exchange, Epex-Spot. According to the consulting firm Sia Partners, the MWh even dropped to - 200 euros for a few hours in the morning - a record for France. In total, fourteen hours of negative prices were observed on Sunday, already much more than the ten hours recorded for the whole of 2012.
How common is this phenomenon?
France, not very customary in fact, is far from being isolated. Negative prices were also observed in other European countries, such as Germany (- 3,33 euros per MWh Sunday), Belgium (- 40,99 euros), observes the Epex-Spot Stock Exchange in a press release published on Monday .

Spain and Denmark are also regularly affected. All these countries have one thing in common: that of being large wind or solar producers.

What are the causes ?
In its press release, Epex-Spot explains these negative prices by an excess of production, caused on the one hand by mild temperatures and on the other hand by high levels of production of so-called "non-flexible" energies (nuclear, hydraulic, wind, photovoltaic), that is to say with little or no production that can be adjusted according to demand.

Solar or wind electricity does in fact benefit from an "injection priority", that is to say that it is sold in priority on the electrical networks, in front of other means of production - which obliges distributors to buy it.

Clean energy is also subsidized and produced at fixed costs, which encourages operators to overproduce, even when demand is low. Consequently, wholesale electricity prices in Europe are pulled down during peaks in wind or solar production, until they become negative on an ad hoc basis.

What are the consequences ?
For Sia Partners, this phenomenon "undermines the difficult balance of European electricity markets", and in particular the profitability of gas-fired power stations, as illustrated by the multiplication of closures or cocooning of installations in Europe (including three French gas power stations of GDF Suez).

In fact, in a period of negative prices, their owners must pay to sell their electrons, or stop their installations, which therefore run less and less. However, "when there is no wind and no sun, it will be necessary to produce with backup power plants, and if everyone shuts them down, we risk being faced with an insoluble problem", warns Cédric. Jeancolas, from Sia Partners.

According to him, the consumer is far from winning. On the one hand, it participates in the financing of subsidies for renewable energies, and on the other, it pays the "broken pots": when electricity producers have to pay to sell their production, this ends up being reflected in the bills.


3 or 4 reflections:

a) we will not progress easily in terms of renewable electric energy if we do not manage to better "modulate" consumption (all washing machines should have been running at that time!)

b) the export / import balance of nuclear energy presented in MWh or TWh is not a good indicator; it is the value of this electricity that should be considered [buy at the peak of cold 1 MWh of very expensive electricity and sell in full summer at a loss the same MWh, it is not the same from the point of view of the portfolio ]

c) I regretted that the pricing policy tends to erase this price difference, which, if it is not passed on to the fianl consumer, will not encourage us to change our habits (see a)

d) I also regretted that the pricing of cogenerated energy from biomethane is the same whatever the need; this energy is naturally easy to store; it would be enough to double the capacity of the tanks and the cogeneration group, for a very low additional cost, to inject only for 12 hours a day, when the demand is the highest ... (or triple to inject only 24 8 hours a day)

[Christophe]

Mwarf another delirium of the current economic system!

The title of the subject "to be paid to consume" would have been clearer

ps: you forgot the url source

[Did67]

url: no - I preferred to copy / paste; the pages disappear very quickly and we come across an "error" ...

By citing, and naming the source, this will still be understandable in a few years ...

[Did67]

Well, I did not begin: it is necessary to have that this concerns, during these periods, the little energy which is exchanged on the market "spot" !!! This is obviously not the price paid by distributors for all of the electricity sold that day at that time!

Should search the site of ErdF (or CRE ???) ... Finally, there's a site that gives instantaneous the powers consumed, exchanged ... We could see what it represents!

[Christophe]

For the source, do as I do: copied (partially what is interesting) + source!

For direct electricity quotes: http://www.powernext.com/

I think it is very punctual as a negative price situation but clearly indicates a problem of balancing production / demand!

[Did67]

It is on the RTE site that we have, for France, lots of data.

For your information, Sunday June 16:

a) the power consumed varied between 31 MW at 000 a.m. and 6 MW in the evening; with a curve which seems to "average" around 46 MW

b) on the same day, exports varied between 3 MW and 800 to 7 MW.

Note that at times, we export and we import!

On Powernext, I did not find, for France, the share represented on that day by "spot" exchanges negotiated at negative prices [the majority of exports are carried out under contracts; the "spot" market is really the trash ...]

[Philippe Schutt]

So like that wind and hydraulics are not modular? Yes, but it's just the market organization that is weak and that makes them unmodulated.
In fact the truly non-modular should pay the modular for the service provided (modulation).

Photovoltaics produce when we consume the most so saying "All these countries have one thing in common: that of being large wind or solar producers" misleads people by making them believe that solar produces when there is none. need.

[Did67]

It's certain. In the non-modular, there is nuclear here. And there is hydraulic flow: we do not prevent the Rhine or the Rhône from flowing ...

The powers at stake have nothing to do with that of PV or wind (with us).

For some Danemarck-like countries, the problem may indeed be different ... It is certain that between midnight and 6 a.m., the consumption curves show a serious dip, and that there may be moment, wind!

I do not specifically subscribe to this article. Still, it makes you think!

[Philippe Schutt]

we do not prevent the water from flowing nor the wind from blowing, but we use this force or not, by diverting the current of the river or by directing the blades of the wind turbine.

The anomaly is that these energies have priority when purchased, which means that they are rotated as much as possible instead of using them to regulate.

The morning trough will be reduced by electric cars when the park is sufficient.

[Christophe]

It is on the RTE site that we have, for France, lots of data.

Yes, here: https://www.econologie.com/forums/tableau-de ... 10960.html