Study on Test Bench Reactor-Pantone-Mines de Douai

Edits and changes to engines, experiences, findings and ideas.
echo-engine
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Study on Test Bench Reactor-Pantone-Mines de Douai




by echo-engine » 02/04/07, 15:54

Hello, I represent a group of 8 students-engineers of the Ecole des Mines de Douai.
We can read many things about the Pantone reactor and we chose to carry out a project concerning the Reacteur Pantone.
This consists of designing a prototype (based on the Paul Pantone diagram), making this prototype by adapting it to a car engine (here R25 engine) and testing this prototype.
We make a study that results from an engineering approach, ie purely objective and quantified.
Today, the prototype is finished and we are in the midst of tests on test benches.
For this, we work with a professional test bench: the CRITT M2A.
The first results are not so promising.
In fact, according to the first figures, we consume more fuel (40% more) with a water / petrol mixture at 50% and the power is lowered by 25% (and then decreases with time).
These are results that come from the first tests and are really summarized to the maximum. We are going to develop this study very soon.
In particular, I invite all enthusiasts to visit the site:
www.echo-moteur.fr
You will find information about our group, our prototype, our tests, videos, images and very soon the results of the tests. (engine mapping, etc ...)

To all enthusiasts, do not hesitate to react on the GOLDEN BOOK of our site to leave all your questions and / or remarks.

Thanks to you and econologie.com

Sincerely,

Johan DEGELDER, webmaster of www.echo-moteur.fr
Last edited by echo-engine the 03 / 04 / 07, 23: 35, 1 edited once.
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zac
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by zac » 02/04/07, 18:28

Hi johan and welcome to the site

Read what I put on your guestbook and contact me in mel.
There is all the important information to make a pantone work on this site; read them and you will avoid useless work.

If you miss info, do not hesitate, lots of people on this forum help you; me first but mostly andré and full of other.

On the other hand your "gadjet" it is a miracle that it turns, 40/100 more in consumption you do not surprise me, and it would surprise me that it is able to propel the car : Evil:

Finally we can not do everything to be an engineer and a mechanic; It's not easy. Especially if we have teachers in the legs : Lol: : Lol: : Lol:

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by elephant » 02/04/07, 18:32

Well, of course, we must see what the high priests are going to say (André, Christophe, Bolon, Zac, and all those who will excuse me for having forgotten them)

For my part, in layman, it seems to me already that a bubbler 30 liters is a little bigounet and that it must really cool the gas

Other than that, thank you very much for your initiative that we will all follow with at least as much passion as some follow the Tour de France. But please, no hasty conclusion!
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echo-engine
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Reply Zac




by echo-engine » 02/04/07, 20:04

Good evening Zac, we answered you by mp but we are very open to the constructive remarks ... it is on which we wish to understand why our results are as they are!
Sincerely,
Johan, Echo-Motor
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by zac » 02/04/07, 20:38

Hello

the answer is gone I hope we can do constructive work for everyone.

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by Other » 02/04/07, 22:41

Hello,
I am extremely surprised that you have managed to drive on the road with a system like this, a copper reactor and a bubbler with large welding point, control this on an acceleration is variable speed is the journey of the fighter
I will leave a message later on the book ...
I already managed to run the Chevrolet 100% panton with fuel while driving at 90 kmh constant with a small carburetor not with a bubbler. To make experiments it takes a generator, or in your case a stationary engine branch on the bench, either to make it work at 100% panton or to have it run on water, both in the same reactor did not never given interesting results .. design and differrente ..

Running an engine with fuel vapor is just a heat exchanger.
When an explosion engine works as well with fuel oil as with gasoline, and the exhaust temperature drops by 50% at the end of the reactor it is the index that it works.

Avoid drawing conclusions with something that is not up to date, and do not trust Panton's data, he has had many other experiences and many values ​​have since changed. the 12 inch, 300 mm is not flow in the cement, the depression either ..

Andre
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lio74
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Re: Study on Test Bench-Reactor Pantone-Mines of Douai




by lio74 » 04/04/07, 13:12

echo-motor wrote:Hello, I represent a group of 8 students-engineers of the Ecole des Mines de Douai.
[...]
We make a study that results from an engineering approach, ie purely objective and quantified.
Today, the prototype is finished and we are in the midst of tests on test benches.
For this, we work with a professional test bench: the CRITT M2A.
The first results are not so promising.
In fact, according to the first figures, we consume more fuel (40% more) with a water / petrol mixture at 50% and the power is lowered by 25% (and then decreases with time).
[...]


Hello !

First of all, thank you for coming to express yourself on the forum ! : Cheesy:
as others have said, you will find a good mass of info ...

then, a council, try to contact a person who animates pantone courses, this kind of people can get you around his experience and avoid wasting precious time making the settings !!! (Because I think you have to have a project end date and if the results are not convincing at all ... the project will go to the trash and will not be resumed next year. .)

if not 100% pantone, testing on mowers is simple, it works more or less well ... but it goes no further! the main problem is the missibility of water and fuel, and also their different boiling T ° ... so you lose power over time => a lot of gasoline vapor at the start, then almost water after ...
the most promising vapor-to-air doping ... and that's what makes it the most on cars and tractors !!!
the payasants who did it, are not scientists certe, but they know how to count and at the end of the month it is not difficult to see on the bill that they have decreased their fuel conso 8)

in any case, to have a good scientific approach you must test everything ... and there is a lot of work!

all my encouragements accompany you!
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echo-engine
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by echo-engine » 04/04/07, 22:16

Thank you for the information and advice.
Exactly, Jaques Pochon informed me that a training will be the 14 May in Brittany, we would like to participate.
However, our project ends (for our approach) end of May 2007.
That said, our contractor wishes to continue the studies as early as September 2007, find the main factors and optimize the prototype and the system in general.

Finally, we met some farmers who certified that it worked, but he was using SPAD, not Pantone.
I think there is a lot of confusion between water doping and the Pantone reactor ... Am I wrong?
If not, my group would really like to be able to find the reason for overconsumption. Maybe the entrefert too big (the prototype with 1mm entreffert too restrained the engine ...)? or is it heat loss? the bubbler too bulky?
These are questions we would like answers to and if you can help, do not hesitate.

Finally, we went into this study because farmers seemed so much of the interests of the Pantone system that we wanted to somehow validate their word.

To all, we really want to have your feedback on our guestbook whether it is to advise us or make remarks (not too naughty ... :D )
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by lio74 » 05/04/07, 03:50

echo-motor wrote:........
That said, our contractor wishes to continue the studies as early as September 2007, find the main factors and optimize the prototype and the system in general.

[...]
I think there is a lot of confusion between water doping and the Pantone reactor ... Am I wrong?

[...]
To all, we really want to have your feedback on our guestbook whether it is to advise us or make remarks (not too naughty ... :D )


glad to hear that the subject will have consequences !! :D : Cheesy:

otherwise, as a layman, because I have not yet crossed the threshold of experimentation (although I'm close)
pb on your montage:
-> bubbler too bulky (calculate the pressurization etc ...)
-> no thermal insulation between the reactor and the intake manifold
-> too long between the reactor and the intake manifold ...

So if not attive conclusion that will be able to block the development of the system, and identify well the conditions of operation of YOUR proto !!!! that the following cotinuent more easily the experiments !! : Cheesy:

vi vi .... vapor doping is based on the same principle !!! but it is just steam "" "" "ionized" "" "which is injected in addition !!! make the diffférence with the 100% Pantone !!!

see also Chambrin ...... the patents are there
https://www.econologie.com/chambrin-articles-252.html

the word on the guestbook when I finish peeling your site !!

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"To do something is expensive, to do nothing will cost much more." Koffie Annan

next species endangered: Man ... and it will be good for him !!!

MAN IS A VERY DANGEROUS POLLUTION NATURAL!
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by lio74 » 06/04/07, 16:36

echo-motor wrote:Finally, we went into this study because farmers seemed so much of the interests of the Pantone system that we wanted to somehow validate their word.



hello!

Well, it's a bit of a mess on this forum auto ...
http://www.forum-auto.com/pole-technique/section12/sujet416054.htm

normal! any good auto mechanic who spent a lot of time in a motor, tell him that you inject water ... they do not like the idea : Cheesy: : Cheesy:

good otherwise, given the means you have .... must really make things happen .... there you start from scratch and made the mistakes of beginners, normal like everyone else ....

but when we have seen and even tested the system we are more convinced : Cheesy:

try to contact people who have experiences and modified engines too !!! test on already existing assemblies or even several to compare them ....

I would visit you well !!! is it possible ???

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"To do something is expensive, to do nothing will cost much more." Koffie Annan

next species endangered: Man ... and it will be good for him !!!

MAN IS A VERY DANGEROUS POLLUTION NATURAL!

 


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