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Geothermal heat exchanger

published: 30/11/04, 11:00
by tbird
Hello, I don't know much about it but I would like to build a heating system with a probe in the ground. I saw that it was necessary to drill. but if you already have a well is it possible to put the "probe" (the exchanger) in the well?

Thank you for your lights :D

published: 29/12/05, 10:20
by tbird
well I see that more than a year after my question remains unanswered : Cry:

I contacted official installers, they did not respond either : Shock:

published: 29/12/05, 10:50
by Misterloxo
I believe it is entirely possible.

Besides, I believe that André (great head of the Pantone) who is rampant on the forum has a similar system.

Am I wrong André?

published: 29/12/05, 16:11
by Other
Hello,
For me you do not read all the posts, I have several times described my heating and air conditioning system,
when i have time i will retrace this post

Basically I pump the earth water in an Artesian well the temperature averages from 10c to 12c it passes through an exchanger the freon heat pump 22 absorbs the calories on this water I pump a 5C to 6C on a flow of 25 at 30 liters per minute, (large compressor 5hp) water pump 1hp
This cooled water returns to the earth below the surface of the frozen, or sometimes to the sewer when the earth (the radiator which is the earth cools especially in spring when the snow melts and frozen descends the water of the earth cools locally)
in summer I air condition and I provide all my domestic hot water
or two 60 gallon tanks = 2 x 280 liters In hot weather I provide too much hot water I have to drain it down the drain. Those with pools it is perfect to return to hot in the pool.

Andre

published: 30/12/05, 05:22
by Other
Hello
I found my old post

I have been heating and air conditioning my house with a similar system since 1993 and I have not had any problems except a slight leak of freon 22 in a joint on a pressure switch.
Basically I bought an old air water pump that was the size of a refrigerator, the engine is a 5hp brand Mamouthe, I recondition it is I install an exchanger to heat the hot water tanks (2 of 60 gallons imperial) in summer when I do air conditioning. At the level of the house I drive a point of 2 inches the ground is sandy the depth is 18 feet and I pump water at the beginning the pump of 1 hp supplied 7 gallons an hour now it
supplied 4,5 to 5 gallons in winter it becomes tangent because the water enters at 9C and leaves the exchanger at 4c. The water at the beginning of winter in November it is 11c when the ground is covered with snow it is 12c it gradually decreases to be 9c in April, but at this time we
use it less. (water is at its coldest in spring in May)
In order not to weaken the water table (although it seems gigantic)
I return the cold water in a 4 inch plastic tube with saw marks 30 feet further, and it is not enough, because in very cold periods
january-february -25 and more the machine works more often which causes the earth's water to drop to 8 or 9 c then I have to make a return
in the sewer for a week and the water temperature rises to 10c therefore keep the water return as far as possible from the pumping point.
Something else in the summer when we do air conditioning at the beginning I don't need
to pump water, all the heat goes into the hot water tanks for a maximum of 45 to 50c then you have to drain the hot water and I do not recommend returning hot water to the ground because after a some time the pump can no longer push the hot water through the saw lines of the 4 inch pipe there is a kind of algae or mud in the screen. So in summer we send hot water to the surface or to the sewer but be careful some municipalities do not accept this, even that it is clean water.
The compressor draws 25 amperes the 4,5 amp water pump the 1,5 amp fan and the small recirculation pump for hot water tanks it is insignificant in reality the whole system draws around 30 amps at 220 volts and with that I heat my house all winter (it is very cold in Quebec and the heating period goes from October to April.
At the beginning I made hot water even in winter, it is profitable when the water of the aqueduct and very cold 5c is that we raise it to 35 to 38 c then to go to 50 55c it is very long and it does not become profitable anymore I find that we run a factory to heat water., as the KW costs 6 cents here it is not worth it, I prefer to make hot water in summer when I air condition , anyway we end up with an excess of hot water that must be sent to the sewer.
The disadvantages, the ventilation is noisy, the machine runs for 3 minutes and more before generating heat so that if you have an overly sensitive thermostat the machine starts every 10 minutes and runs 6 minutes in winter, to correct this inconvenient I add a (timer) kind of timed relay on the thermostat that is to say when it asks to heat, I delay the signal by 30 minutes that makes that the temperature varies more or less 2 to 3 degrees, you get used to it. or I had a lot of trouble finding the right load of freon and adjusting the thermostatic valves on the water flow. but there, the machine is ready.
Be careful when you talk about performance. it is very good when the differential is large, that is to say that the air in the room is cold, it performs but if we heat harder it drops and it is very variable depending on the pressures of the freon which varies with the temperature in summary it is difficult to regulate it is necessary to make compromises the yield goes from 3,5 to 2 compared to the kw consumed. a simple indication is to measure the water passing through the exchanger with a meter and to measure the temperature entering and leaving, a simple calculation gives us the calories recovered from the water. Be careful to measure the water after the pump because it gains 0,5 to 0,8 degrees as it passes through the pump.
If there are some who want more specific details I would communicate them to you

Andre

published: 30/12/05, 09:08
by tbird
Thank you André, I do not understand everything being an electronician and not a physicist. If I understand correctly, we can recover a second-hand refrigeration system heated with water.
but which part of the cold group must be connected to the artesian well. and how to link. if I put a single hose with a pump to draw water, it has to be deep.

by my place (south of France, Montpellier) it rarely freezes and the outside temperature is on average winter + 5 ° C
can the system work under these conditions.
what heating temperature will i get?

is it possible to return the water leaving the system to the well itself?

can we heat water so as to make a central heating with radiator?

as you see I still have a lot to learn : Wink:

published: 30/12/05, 23:21
by christ59000
hello, for heating by heat pump in your corner no worries, with the new system R410A we can operate up to -20 ° c outside, the warmer it is outside the better the heating system, it c for the air system / air for the outdoor group, if you want to do the assembly with the well, it is even better because the water is at constant temperature all year round, therefore stable electrical consumption but you need an air / water exchanger resistant to various attacks of corrosion , I am astonished that no professional could inform you on the subject, the demand for geothermal heat pump increases more and more then there must be some in your department, for the artisanal assembly of the pump has heat, it takes knowledge and material only a person with notions in cold can help you