rech. motor + 200 cv pantonisé info

[phil 14]

Hello everyone
A friend, a food producer, works with a generator set with a Renault 6 cyl diesel engine. of 9.5 liters of displacement !! (280 hp I believe).
He is very interested in the work of all the members of the forum and he asked me to look for people who could give him the starting points (volume of the bubbler, number of reactors ... ??)
THANK YOU PHIL 14

[Christophe]

I guess he's a business owner? Doesn't Pkoi himself come here if he wants to profit from this research? Because I suppose that once he has what he wants, he will disappear ... like many others ... You have to understand that at this rate the "we" (that is to say the very small group of members who animate this forum ) will not last long..Know it ...

Then..Pkoi always ask for information which is freely accessible by searching a little ... It's true what ... soon no one will answer the basic questions ...

[phil 14]

Hello econology
As far as my friend who makes food is concerned, he has a very small business which is not even supplied by EDF. Or the use of such a group, which currently costs him a fortune. does not know the net either.
Regarding my request, it's been almost 3 months since I come to the forum to discover a lot of info that I print so as not to forget them, but I have not been able to find any concerning engines of such a displacement. Yet I spend a certain number of hours in your forum that fascinates me.
I am thinking of doing my first edit, as soon as my summer market gardening season is going to end.
See you soon
phil 14

[jelupan]

Hi phil 14,
you should have taken a look on the quanthomme site to get an idea of ​​the assembly for your friend:


and you go down on the generators. There is one of them, 365 hp, pantonized in spad fashion!
For explanations and plans see on spad site.
A +

[Other]

Hi phil 14
You can be inspired by the spad but all in stainless steel, or that of Toftof
What you need to know is if the generator is often at full capacity.
or half capacity, just to establish the number of reactors, which must be able to operate without being in a state of overheating, if you want a good performance. If you put too many reactors you will run out of heat at half speed and if you do not put enough there is a risk that you will not be able to absorb the temperature, Even reason for the too small bubbler the water will boil too much large it slow to heat up or too much heat radiation
So the first thing to assess is the physical locations to install
In order to bring the elements as close as possible, especially the very short reactor bubbler pipe.
then has how many KVA the machine runs most often because 365 HP they are available but not necessarily used.
A large 19 or 23mm rod reactor has the same restriction as 2 small 12,7mm, easier to make than a multiples.
Andre
Andre

[phil 14]

THANKS JELUPAN AND ANDRE FOR YOUR MAIL
Question to André
You understood my problem well, it is to evaluate the various parameters which you indicate to me in your message and which, according to what you taught me, have a great importance on the output of the assembly.
I thought I would start on the following bases:
- bubbler volume of 30 liters
- water volume in bubbler: 20 liters (maybe too much)
therefore a volume of water vapor of 10 l.
is this sufficient for a 9.6 liter engine ???
I would like to have an idea of ​​the temperature of the exhaust gases leaving the engine. Is it greater than that of a smaller motor. What can I measure it with ??? how does a thermocouple work ??
I also envisioned heating the water of the bubbler with the water of the cooling circuit which would allow me to have a constant temperature, but 20l. of water it may take too long to heat ??
Regarding the engine, it turns 90% of the time at full load so I thought to put 4 reactors with rods of 15 (as spad for 200 hp) but I should rather plan that 2 larger diameter as you me the council.
I also hesitate on the diameter of the reactor outlet pipe which arrives before the inlet pipe!

THANKS everyone for your tips.

PHILL 14

[phil 14]

Hello again
My last idea for a bubbler to be mounted on my generator (use of the electricity produced by the group)
What do you think???
A+
PHILL 14

[Other]

Hello answer phil

Your bubbler must have a vertical design high enough, you must not make steam by boiling, it must be airtight the air hole at the top has no place the only air entering it is a dip tube in the liquid the suction of the engine via the reactor creates the necessary vacuum to cross a water column of at least 150mm 200mm preferable therefore all the air which enters the reactor passes in bubble in the water therefore the tube which brings the air must be at the bottom of the bubbler, if possible full of fine stripes or small holes distributed on the surface of the bubbler.
As for the water heating system and given that you are in the presence of a large generator, the idea is good, it will just consume additional energy but great stability.
It remains to do a controlled level, although if you design a fairly flat tank so the level variation to oscillate between 150 and 200 mm it will not affect the operation much,
It lacks baffels (deflectors) at the top of the bubbler to retain the internal storm of the bubbler.
When the duct that comes out of the reactor it must be section in square mmilimeter 1,5 times greater or more depending on the length or the elbows, than the total section of the passage between the rod and the reactor, calculated for the 2 if it are connected in common.
If you put a large bubbler with a good water supply, electric heat
it is necessary to envisage a consumption of 3 liters per hour for a motor of this size which forces it would be advantageous that you provide a system at constant level as you are the same source of current it will be easy for you to find electrical equipment for that, only in 12 volts. Or more simply a large gravity tank with a float that maintains a constant level. something that can work for a day without having to feed it
Your engine is an in-line engine uo a V6 uo a V8 l, is the exhaust common or are there two branches? to know if you put 2 reactors per branch or 2 reactors in common (more difficult to design it is necessary to make inlet and outlet collectors without too much bend 90)
the turbo or atmospheric engine?
The bubbler is in stainless steel c, is the same work as in steel a little more expensive but it restricts clean, the red water at the bottom of the bubbler is gross. there is no better way to rust than hot water that evaporates.
The tube which comes out of the bulb and which goes to the reactor must be calculated big, too big it does not bother, it must be short as possible if not it must be isolated to avoid the condensations.
You plant a transparent plastic tuayu in the intake manifold and you measure the suction in operation at stabilized speeds at the frequency of the 50hz generator for you other that must give 1500 rpm for your 4 pole engine. The plastic tube you put it in a water container the water must rise from 700mm to 1000mm in the tube, if not it will take a venturi in the suction, normally the air filter and the elbows in the collector give naturally a restriction. the good functioning of the reactor depends on this suction the consumption of water and directly proportional to this suction, I am refractory to put a valve to restrict the admission of a diesel.
The temperature is not very high in a diesel that rarely exceeds 700c it is rather 600c atmospheric under load and 500 c with turbo.
Andre

[Other]

Important
do not forget to put a small fine mesh in the duct that comes out of the reactor just before entering the collector, this is a restriction
harmful but good protection for any part of welding or
small metallic pieces of the reactor which could come off that the diesel will gulp down in a hellish noise, there is no room between the cylinder head and the piston for this kind of filth.
We are amateur welders, you have to plan ahead and speak TOFTOF.
Andre

[phil 14]

Hello André
I have noted all your tips.
Here are some details about my GE engine
ENGINE 6 cyl. in-line turbo of 9.6 l. of displacement.
I think to put 2 reactors of 23mm in common, which poses a small problem for me for the placement of the rods and the plugs used to immobilize the 2 rods of reactors.
Does not the presence of a turbo in a water doping vary the suction of the gas in the intake ??? The arrival of gas is well planned in front of the turbo ???
THANK YOU
PHILL 14