The car stinks, it pollutes, and it makes stupid!

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The Passing
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The car stinks, it pollutes, and it makes stupid!




by The Passing » 21/01/06, 20:04

Eh eh : Cheesy:

Funny the tone of this site: http://chicheweb.org/rubrique.php3?id_rubrique=26
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Rulian
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by Rulian » 31/01/06, 09:24

I think they have quite a lot of articles at carfree france ...

But we find this one in particular which deserves to be read by all the regulars of this forum. This article summarizes my thoughts very well and should, in my opinion, be read beforehand by any aspiring Pantonist in order to properly frame the limits of the PMC:

http://chicheweb.org/article.php3?id_article=87

The text :

"There is no more" clean car "than" clean war ". From the looting of natural resources to the production of billions of tons of waste, millions of deaths to the construction of a dehumanized universe, the term "Clean car" is nonsense.

Even before having made its first kilometer, an automobile will have produced a significant part of its pollution. Each new car requires 300 liters of water for its construction. Building a vehicle, "clean" or not, requires 000 times more raw materials than its own weight, 20 tonnes to produce a 30 tonne car (1,5). At the other end of the chain, two million light passenger vehicles are thrown away in France each year, including 1 tonnes of old tires, 280 tonnes of battery residues and 000 tonnes of special industrial waste (30). Even if an increasingly large part of this waste is recycled, its transformation in turn leads to new pollution. With an oversized nuclear fleet, France seeks to promote the electric car under the “clean car” label. However, it has a much lower eco-balance than a conventional vehicle, with on-board thermal engine. According to ADEME (000), the electric car requires 400% more energy for the same efficiency. Energy is produced outside the vehicle. It must therefore be transported, then stored, which generates significant losses at each stage. The batteries (lead, cadmium ...) necessary for this storage are themselves highly harmful and produce waste with an infinite lifespan. One of the rare advantages of the electric vehicle is the low noise level at low speed. From 000 km / h, this gain disappears, friction noise outweighing that of the engine. The “ecological car”, which consumes only three liters every 2 km, makes driving cheaper and therefore more attractive. The number of cars on the road and the number of kilometers driven are increasing accordingly. This is the same perverse effect as for new vehicles: the motorist more easily resorts to a car in good condition, especially if it has an environmental label. Its movement will not then be transferred to a truly ecological mode (walking, cycling, public transport ...). In addition, if new vehicles emit less CO3, these gains are often canceled out by the arrival of air conditioning in series, a large energy drainer and producer of highly toxic pollutants (CFCs, etc.).
Air pollution, looting of non-renewable natural resources and waste are only part of the nuisance of the "clean car". The noise, the millions of dead, wounded, with their procession of physical and psychological trauma, insecurity, stress, hatred, the invasion of space, the concreting and dehumanization of our living environment remain. Even powered by an organic carrot juice engine, the automobile would remain the main source of ecological and social nuisance for our civilizations. Air pollution only makes it more visible to us.
It is important to understand that the purchase of a car is not limited to the acquisition of the vehicle as such but also to the whole universe which is linked to it, i.e. highways, ring roads, service stations, oil tankers to transport fuel, supermarkets (reachable by car), factories (to produce these cars and this universe) ... a whole environment which generates a way of life origin of most of the environmental crisis.
Let us recall that 80% of the world population does not use a car, that the automobile has become widespread in Europe only for forty years. The motorist is marginal both in time and in space. The obsession with the search for a technical solution to the nuisances caused by the automobile is symptomatic of the dominant ideology. The crusaders of progress would like that in the name of realism, we make a cross on our humanist dream of a world without car. Not only does a genuinely rational approach require the exact opposite, but, as we know, the only credible response to the ecological crisis is cultural, philosophical, political. Technical responses, if important, remain secondary. The problem is not to build clean cars, but to stop producing cars. The discourse of the defenders of the “ecological automobile” in fact joins that of the promoters of “sustainable development” or of “sustainable growth”.
It consists in repainting in green a system based on two irrational beliefs: the infinite nature of planetary resources and the unlimited capacity of the biosphere to absorb our expansion. A culturally counterproductive attitude, because it supports a fundamentally destructive system. Like the clean car touted by EDF, it will present a negative eco-balance. "

To read, reread, meditate and learn by heart.
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Cuicui
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by Cuicui » 31/01/06, 10:38

Me, I find that at present, we have not found better than motorized vehicles with 2 or 4 wheels to move quickly, efficiently and freely. Without a car, I would be very annoyed. While waiting for the development of vehicles based on antigravity or synergetic engines, I find it vital to find a way to pollute less. Long live the Pantone and the rapeseed oil engine!
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by Rulian » 31/01/06, 10:55

Studies have shown more than 20 years ago that in urban areas, the fastest vehicle is the bicycle ...

And between cities, the train is frankly very competitive (and they take the bikes in addition)

See at carfree france, all the necessary clarifications are there.
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by Cuicui » 31/01/06, 11:01

The train is good, but it's expensive. And the schedules should suit me. Individual vehicles offer unmatched flexibility.
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by Christophe » 31/01/06, 11:21

It's beautiful to dream of an anti-car world (just like a water engine). But when we oppose 95% (car user + or - regularly) of the population how would you like to be listened to?

The reality is unfortunately in the figures and such utopian speeches will not change anything (at least in the short term):

https://www.econologie.com/le-poids-econ ... s-775.html
Last edited by Christophe the 03 / 04 / 15, 12: 33, 1 edited once.
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by Rulian » 31/01/06, 11:25

Well yes, if the schedules have to suit everyone and if no one wants to make an effort and wait for the train for 20 minutes, we will go far in the fight against pollution. However, trains in France overall have a very good frequency of passage.

When the train, long distance c often cheaper than the car. And don't forget to count ALL the costs of your car in the calculation (purchase, insurance, repairs ...). This is something often overlooked, but it's not just gasoline in the cost of a car, far from it.

Worse if the unequaled flexibility is to endure the traffic jams and to turn three hours to have a parking space ... Me, I don't really like ...

And I'm even talking about the comparison of the CO2 balance of the car (pantone or not ...) and public transport and train. Environment first or lazy to make a little effort? Need to know.
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by Christophe » 31/01/06, 11:28

It’s clear ... For once Rulian doesn’t talk too much bullshit ( : Cheesy: ) I will support it.

Beyond 100 km (and depending on the service obviously) I systematically take the train (I'm not even thinking about the price).

Example: I have never been to Paris by car (ok I have only been there 10 times but good ...)

In addition to being less tiring, the train allows you to work which is not the case with a car journey ....
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by Rulian » 31/01/06, 11:28

Econology wrote:It's beautiful to dream of an anti-car world (just like a water engine). But when we oppose 95% (car user + or - regularly) of the population how would you like to be listened to?

The reality is unfortunately in the figures and such utopian speeches will not change anything (at least in the short term):


And well before being listened to I start by applying my speech to myself. Utopian discourses? Many people live without cars. And in big cities it's extremely easy !!

I live without a box by choice and I am doing very well thank you! I would at least like people to have the honesty to try (at least those who live in the city) before saying that it is "utopian".

Fucking addiction ...
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by Christophe » 31/01/06, 11:33

Rulian wrote:I live without a box by choice and I'm doing very well thank you ...


1) You're still a student so it would surprise me that it was by choice ... you simply don't need it. It is not a choice.

2) Arguement con but so realistic (of people's stupidity) for the future: send CVs for an engineer position saying that you have no cash or private means of transport ... you will see the reaction (fascite !!!) of the HRD! Op ... classified cv (trash can)! Even in the interim you work more without cash ... (+ apparently more important than the diploma / abilities ...) It's lamentable (but it's like that!) ....:| [paranoid mode] Did they receive "orders" from a higher authority? [/ paranoid mode]

3) It is easy to break this argument by talking about the unemployment rate at the beginning of the XXth century or almost no one had a car .... The guy opposite remains speechless ... It's quite fun as an experience :D (but not good for hiring LOL)

Otherwise yes for the city it confirms what I said in my Parisian example on condition of shopping exclusively at the neighborhood stall (I am obviously)
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