To all those who have experienced the water doping

[lau]

If you have pictures of filters, I am interested.
I would like to install one towards the exit of the bubbler, moreover it would slow down I think my excess water consumption.

[Rabbit]

For the infusion of water applied to my R19 engine running
at LPG .J uses an aquarium bubbler to filter the water and avoid
the needle is blocked.
Something like this, but square:
Oops, I haven't read all of the above. I don't use anything special
to make small drops or other micro droplets.
I inject water directly into the air intake. Once the engine is warm, this does not seem to be a problem.
The consumption differs from 1 to 2 of LPG liters per 100 km
The water consumption is from 0.5 to 0.75 l per 100 km.
No real power dif but this may be due to
adjustment of the flow which is carried out at idle (1000 rpm).
The injection takes place after the butterfly and depends on the
depression, It is not easy to regulate this water flow proportionally
at the opening of the butterfly.
In winter it does not work too much, the water freezes. You have to wait 10 or
15 km to benefit from the system.

[PITMIX]

André what filter are you talking about?
I recuperated in a cartridge holder of filter drier a cone in very fine mesh in stainless steel. It can be called a tami or a strainer depending on the place and the use we make of it.
I cut a washer and installed it in my water carburetor. It serves as a filter and prevents large drops. But I believe that for large drops it is too close to the wash bottle.
It seems to me that we can also use coffee filters.

[lau]

coffee filters there is a slice of bread!
I think that a conical shape giving inside the bubbler would also be suitable for the streaming of large drops.

[campadebulsance]

Hello Andrew,

the famous tractor (fiatagri 115 CV 5L of displacement) of which I spoke some time ago now is finished since approximately 1 month and I still carry out tests today !!


what i can say:

there is apparently no savings made
on plowing with the same tool (the most difficult to pull for the tractor sometimes the tractor does not pass ...)

the tractor consumes without pantone between 15 and 18 liters (value given by the farmer)

currently I am at 15 liters however there is an increase in power
the water consumption is currently around one and a half liters

MECHANICAL PART

my system is a bubbler heated by the coolant
-capacity of the bubbler about 3litres
- water height 220mm
-filling is automatic

310,3 / 4 inch stainless steel reactors L = 280mm are double, positioned horizontally
the direction of flow of the vapors are in the same direction as those of exhaust (different from pantone)

the copper leaving the reactor is dull blue brown in color
I specify that the pipes are at the shortest (no elbow ...)
silver solder
no pipe is insulated except the flexible connections connecting bubbler and reactors

there is currently no air filter clamping flap (see)
bubbling starts at around 1200rpm

I FIND!:

ALL TESTS CARRIED OUT ON FIATAGRI TRACTORS HAVE NEVER BEEN CONCLUDING !!!
c is still strange ... maybe we should compare the FIAT mechanical assembly of its competitors MASSEY, NEW HOLLAND, CASE ....
Compression ratio; torque; etc ...

[PITMIX]

So there indeed it is strange.
Imagine that some mechanics do not accept the Pantone.
I rather think that the realization must be different according to each.
You almost have to take the system from a working tractor and put it on a FIAT tractor of equal power.

[Other]

Hello campadelbulsance

Your engine is similar to mine 5 cylinders 123 hp just the displacement which is larger me 3 liters and you 5 liters and you a lower revolution which is an advantage.
For the reactor it is not advantageous to have put it in the same direction as the exhaust flow (not for stories of reverse flow, which I believe no more) but for thermal reasons. Knowing that the temperature drops rapidly during the passage over the reactor and since we need a certain high temperature at the end of the reactor, this poses a problem.
For the 3/4 pipe reactor body this in principle gives a rod from 19 to 20mm for a length of 150 mm a clearance of 1mm
What is the size of the outlet duct?
I find that the copper pipe does not come so hot for a water consumption of 1 liter, normally to force a motor like this 15 liters per hour, the copper should become brass or gold.
Either it passes large drops of water and little air, normally with the heat given off in two reactors if there is good circulation of humid air it has good absorption of heat and this is seen at the outlet tube of the reactor.
Now if there passes little product in the reactor, it does not heat much at the outlet, it can come from the entry into the intake manifold, it is necessary to favor the suction (but if it pulls through 220 mm of water it must to be good)
The bubbler is not so big in diameter to have a level of 220mm and a volume of 3 liters, this risks making a big bubble bubbling and a lot of splash. good now that everything is done just try to correct it without disfiguring everything

For the bubbler it will be necessary to place a thick textile pad at the top, to limit splashing and let pass only the fine vapors.
Hoping that the reactor tube rod clearance is not too large, especially the multiple reactor.
I am far from convinced that a large short reactor outlet pipe is better than a pipe of a certain length and of the right diameter. some engine works very well with an internal 12mm tube and 600mm long.

Andre

[lau]

yes, 12 or 14mm inside diameter at the reactor outlet is more important than the length of the latter.
For a 115hp 5L. displacement I think 14 int. reactor output is not bad but I find your consumption of water surprisingly low for a 5Litres of displacement without particular restriction at this level? I wonder if the depression is enough:
To review the venturi, the diam. inlet pipe of the bubbler / reactor; hoping that there is no sealing bp. however the bubbling at 1200 revolutions is good, 1200 revolutions is approx. 300tours more than idling.
* Avoid the cooling circuit to heat your bubbler, on tractors that have results it is heating with the exhaust and always with reverse flow (gas and exhaust gas).
You could also have benefited, if you have not already done so, by running your reactor in North / South position for the first 30 minutes (especially when the rod is cooled) even if some of them forum are incredulous about it ... what does it cost?

I FIND!:

ALL TESTS CARRIED OUT ON FIATAGRI TRACTORS HAVE NEVER BEEN CONCLUDING !!!
c is still strange ... maybe we should compare the FIAT mechanical assembly of its competitors MASSEY, NEW HOLLAND, CASE ....
Compression ratio; torque; etc ...

The CNH group includes FORD / Fiat / newholland / case, there are still some cases under the name Mc cormic out of the CIH factories but no more ford or fiat in new tractor.
In any case I do not know what allows you to say that ?? on quanthomme the fiatagri opt for good results and I don't see why it would not be the same with yours!
See the TR19 which was inspired by n ° 42

If you are still skeptical but very motivated, I see that we are from the same department, I can put you in touch with someone you trust and whom I know very well, who gets 50% min. fuel economy in my corner! .. but it may be necessary to transfer your installation if it remains inoperative despite the mod.
In any case fiat do not have a defect against the pantone.
Keep us in touch!

[rezut]

Hello campadelbulsance

for me the first thing to do would be to put the reactors in the opposite direction to the exhaust flow because I tested on my assembly, no reverse flow = no reduction in consumption

for the heating of the bubbler by LDR not agree with you Lau because on agricultural France there is an article on a tractor which works very well on this principle (do not ask me or I read it I can not say except by searching the net or even on the forum or there is I believe a post dedicated to press articles)

say if it is the best solution there are only the tests and prototypes that will end up demonstrating it but it is true that the majority of the assemblies are heated by the exhaust (to see the very beautiful assembly on mechanical shovel simple and effective hitachi

good campadelbulsance test and keep us informed of developments and future tests

[campadebulsance]

Hello everyone!


to answer André

the internal rod d = 14mm stainless steel 310 l = 115mm
3/4 inch outer tube
1 mm clearance

I gathered my 2 reactors by a T connector
and the outlet duct dia = 16mm

one thing is certain: the copper at the outlet heats up
a drop of water on the copper and it is the immediate evaportion

with regard to the bubbler, its low capacity favors its rise in temperature, thus the bubbler water is at temperature in 5 min.
I installed plates at the top of the bubbler to avoid splashing and I oversized it in height



TO RESPOND TO LAU

I have not yet installed a restriction!
1.5 liters is normal! i want to try to gradually restrict ....

the idling speed is 600 rpm and the tool laden speed is 2300 rpm
I am only at 1100tyr / min below the working regime ...

TO RESPOND TO REZUT

YES, I read agricultural France! and he also speaks of a fiatagri who has obtained no results ...!

I ALSO THINK THAT I MUST REVERSE THE MEANING OF FLOWS!

but it will ask me a hell of a job !!! and in addition I will make a real labyrinth of copper pipe !! (not good elbows !?)
I think that once the work is done, I could become a plumber !!! lol ...