Volkswagate but yes ... and other auto manufacturers?

Transport and new transport: energy, pollution, engine innovations, concept car, hybrid vehicles, prototypes, pollution control, emission standards, tax. not individual transport modes: transport, organization, carsharing or carpooling. Transport without or with less oil.
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I Citro
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by I Citro » 14/11/15, 10:32

Flytox wrote:But on "cheap" vehicles, manufacturers seek more to optimize their costs and certain known more reliable and more expensive solutions are not retained.

For example, rocker arm covers or intake manifolds can be made of plastic instead of aluminum. It's lighter, much cheaper for the manufacturer ...... but after x years of use in hot oil and or under an overheated hood, the aluminum has not moved but the plastic can deform, allow oil to escape or allow air to enter which disturbs the carburation. In both cases, we can end up with a breakage "for stupidity".
It is simply planned obsolescence ...
When I recovered my minivan at 210.000 km at the weight of the scrap, I made a big overhaul, including the half shell of the plastic calorstat which was deformed and oozed ...
Despite all my care this engine remains a fryer that oozes oil everywhere ... Nothing to do with the quality of my old VOLVO or a Japanese woman who does not lose a drop of oil before 200.000km ...
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chatelot16
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by chatelot16 » 14/11/15, 18:45

the gs leveled off at 155, when I had my first GSA and saw the meter go up to 180 I thought the meter was wrong, but I checked it on the highway with the km sign and the stopwatch counter was fair!

I confirm, at this speed it was a chasm ... it was just to say that a small displacement engine can go fast, but it is better that it is rare

I quoted the GS to say that there has long been a fairly solid, but not perfect, small engine: a calamity for oil leaks, too many fragile seals and too difficult to change

is this planned obsolescence? manufacturers have always been too complicated to maintain .... when in a new model they do better at one end it is worse at the other end and it is never entirely good
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by I Citro » 15/11/15, 19:07

I think that at the time, Citroën was thinking of saving money on the engine by designing a mechanism devoid of water circuit, radiator, pump and thermal regulation system ...
One way to compensate for the additional cost caused by the hydraulic system.

The Simca 1100, a direct competitor to the GS, stood out for its simplicity of maintenance. I remember the arguments of a mechanic who recommended a used Simca to a buyer who was looking for a used GS ... Labor times were in favor of Simca:
clutch or gearbox replacement: 12 hours for the GS, 3 hours for the Simca ...
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by chatelot16 » 15/11/15, 19:15

it is sure that the gs was not a simple car ... and it sold second-hand at a ridiculous price because nobody wanted it ... I took advantage of it!

air cooling is not an economical solution, it is rather an aviation type solution ... it rises higher in temperature so high quality steel is needed, especially for the valves

to better understand why this bizarre engine you should know that it is the last panhard! citroen had just bought panhard

I found it very reliable, never completely broken down ... lots of stuff that can mess up but always come to the end of the trip ... except electronic ignition of the gsa which all screwed up and that I had to replace with ignition switch of gs 1220 ... fortunately it went up very well

and again it was necessary to sort; it is my oldest ducellier igniter which was mounted on my GSA ... the marschal switch igniter were pigs ...
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by I Citro » 15/11/15, 19:52

In fact the flat oven engine of the GS was 100% Citroën and had no Panhard genes ... :?

Citroën bought Panhard to sink a competitor, as Mittal bought Arcelor ...
During the years when Citroën had to legally supply Panhard spare parts, it sabotaged the products supplied. For example, the lubrication of the crankpins and piston pins was done by drip shafts. On the standard exchange engines supplied by Citroën, punches on the drips prevented the correct lubrication of the moving parts ...

Panhard had in his boxes, before Citroën bought the brand a serious competitor for the GS which was a "Panhard 24" in 4-door version with 4-cylinder engine.

The 4-cylinder engine of the "future Panhard" was extrapolated from the famous twin-cylinder to 1600 competition victories but had an X-shaped architecture and not flat like on the GS. This architecture considerably improved the cooling of the rear cylinders, a black spot in flat engines ...

If this car had seen the light, its much appreciated style would have overshadowed the GS ...
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Re: Volkswagate yes but ... and the other automakers?




by moinsdewatt » 07/04/16, 20:13

Diesel Commission: no fraud but standards not met

07 April 2016

Unsurprisingly, none of the 52 Diesel tested by the Royal Commission meets the CO2 and NOx standards

We expected this term for mid-March, but it does not arrive until April 7th. Here is finally completed the first half of the campaign of measurements of polluting emissions of one hundred cars wanted by the independent commission of inquiry of the Minister Ségolène Royal, the day after the revelation of the Volkswagen scandal. This delay must be seen as proof of the seriousness with which UTAC CERAM conducted these tests, both on chassis dynamometers (vehicle stationary) and on the road, with a mobile laboratory harnessed to the car. To get an overview of the method used, click on the article: "Understand everything about UTAC tests".

Unsurprisingly, all the models tested to date emit significantly more carbon dioxide (CO2) and nitrogen oxides (NOx) than the thresholds authorized by the Euro 5 and Euro 6 standards in force at the time of their approval. 5 to 10 times for NOx; from 12% to 40% for CO2.

"We have not learned much more than during the first tests (published on January 14, editor's note) and the results confirm that there are difficulties with some manufacturers, notably Renault and Opel", told the AFP a representative of the Ministry of the Environment. "Like last time, we see that there is obviously an optimization for the manufacturers of the passage of the test which is done in the laboratory while the results are very different on the road, it is generalized", she added. .

Renault and Opel: bad students but not fraudsters

However, the Commission of Inquiry cannot conclude for the time being in the use of any fraud device. For its part, the DGCCRF investigation into Renault's practices is continuing (read our article: "Where is the DGCCRF investigation at Renault"). The Director General of the Directorate General for Competition, Consumption and the Repression of Fraud (DGCCRF) Nathalie Homobono declared at the beginning of March that at the stage at which the investigation was then at, there still did not exist element making it possible to formulate a presumption of fraud at Renault comparable to that which exists against Volkswagen. On April 5, 2016, Nathalie Homobono revealed to the deputies who are members of the Information Mission on the French automotive supply that the investigators of the DGCCRF are now in the phase of hearing Renault executives. "It is a question of obtaining comments, explanations on the parts which seem to interest our investigation", she specified.

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http://automobile.challenges.fr/actu-au ... ctees.html
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Re: Volkswagate yes but ... and the other automakers?




by dede2002 » 08/04/16, 11:46

Concerning gasoline engines, the manufacturers "cheat" since the beginning of the antipollution measures, because there is a full load contactor which bypasses the lambda regulation in loop to enrich the mixture, which temporarily prevents (or for a long time, in case route around the road thoroughly) the catalyst to oxidize HC and CO.
Without this device, the maximum power displayed should be reduced to avoid breakage ...
But during the homologation test you never put the full throttle!
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The advantage of air-cooled engines is that the combustion chamber reaches temperature more quickly, ideal for short journeys.
On the other hand, this temperature is unstable, which makes combustion control random, and which explains their disappearance.
The GS I knew them by heart, when I was 17 I worked in a small garage and all the GS were for me, I quickly understood why :P
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Re: Volkswagate yes but ... and the other automakers?




by Christophe » 08/04/16, 11:50

All this had been predicted on econology for a while ... : Cheesy:
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Re: Volkswagate yes but ... and the other automakers?




by Gaston » 18/04/16, 14:14

dede2002 wrote:there is a full load contactor which short-circuits the lambda loop control to enrich the mixture, which momentarily prevents (or for a long time, in the event of a full road trip) the catalyst to oxidize the HC and CO.
Without this device, the maximum power displayed should be reduced to avoid breakage ...
But during the homologation test you never put the full throttle!
And in real life either ...

The motorway route "thoroughly", that no longer exists since the 2cv and 4L ...
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moinsdewatt
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Re:




by moinsdewatt » 20/04/16, 13:43

Temission reports: after Volkswagen, Mitsubishi admits to defrauding
Mitsubishi acknowledges having manipulated emission tests to present better fuel efficiency. 625 vehicles would be affected.


SOURCE AFP on 20/04/2016

Japanese automaker Mitsubishi Motors admitted on Wednesday that it had "manipulated tests to present better fuel efficiency", a fraud that concerns at least 625 small vehicles, some of which were built for the Nissan group. This announcement comes at a time when the automotive industry is subject to increased controls, while the German giant Volkswagen is grappling with a rigged engine scandal.
"We extend our deepest apologies to all of our customers and other affected parties," said Japanese group boss Tetsuro Aikawa at a press conference with the Ministry of Transportation. "Our customer Nissan discovered discrepancies between the figures provided and those observed and asked us to review our values," said the manufacturer in a statement. "We decided to stop production and sales of the models in question," he added, adding that Nissan had done the same.

Mitsubishi Motors, known for its Outlander and Pajero 4x4, sells around one million vehicles per year. For the full year ended March 2016, the company is targeting revenue of 2 billion yen (260 billion euros). Its results are due to be released on April 18.

The case recalls the scandal that has shaken Volkswagen for months. This group admitted in the fall that it has installed software in 11 million of its vehicles worldwide capable of falsifying the polluting emission values ​​of diesel engines. He risks tens of billions of euros in fines and damages.


http://www.lepoint.fr/automobile/tests- ... 89_646.php
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