The renewable energy hydrogen car: the future?

Transport and new transport: energy, pollution, engine innovations, concept car, hybrid vehicles, prototypes, pollution control, emission standards, tax. not individual transport modes: transport, organization, carsharing or carpooling. Transport without or with less oil.
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Remundo
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by Remundo » 10/06/18, 12:39

xboxman4 wrote:
Remundo wrote:the H2 car is a humbug. Hypertechnology, an energy chasm, a captive clientele, very inadequate supply infrastructures.

What is needed is a dominantly electric hybrid at an affordable price. Basically a good specification would be:
* car 4 5 places, 1000 kg, not too much frontal area
* 15-20 kWh of battery to make 100 km in electric
* generator 3 40 cylinders kW (50 ch)
* power 75 kW (100 ch) electric, with possibility of boost to 150 kW when the generator supports the batteries
* simple car: not too many gadgets and electronics

In addition the engine should be more gasoline, and accept 85 ethanol.

And at the same time; we must strengthen the electricity mix in renewable energy, and also the mix of fuels in renewable liquids: methanol, ethanol, biodiesel ...


And you believet that the lithium battery of the VE does notai not one of humbug? Future shortage, rising lithium prices, problematic recycling, crappy cycling ... In short, all the opposite of hydrogen precisely.

Humor is your spelling.

Otherwise Lithium batteries are recycled very well, eventually they will be recycled as those lead. On the other hand, it is necessary to limit both the embedded kWh and the number of vehicles to avoid over-exploitation.
The H2 is an energy vector: it is an inexhaustible source

An energy vector is not a source of energy, let alone inexhaustible ...
it is easy to produce (an electrolyzers is not a complex system forelle), little be produced from any source of energy. Storage systemsthey have gotten betteroré (carbon fiber, high pressure, light weight, safety) and allow cyclicage practically unlimitedthe.

you go bankrupt at Petit Larousse and Gros Robert! : Mrgreen:
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Eric DUPONT
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by Eric DUPONT » 10/06/18, 13:00

there is more future in the car than liquid nitrogen. for the liquid nitrogen the efficiency of the well at the wheel is likely to reach 60% against 45% for the hydrogen. liquid nitrogen is more easily stored in large quantities at lower cost with renewable energy is less true for hydrogen. At the level of security, we do not know, for the hydrogen, we have to see what gives a tank pierced by bullet.
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moinsdewatt
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by moinsdewatt » 10/06/18, 13:45

Eric Dupont wrote:there is more future in the car than liquid nitrogen. for the liquid nitrogen the efficiency of the well at the wheel is likely to reach 60% against 45% for the hydrogen. liquid nitrogen is more easily stored in large quantities at lower cost with renewable energy is less true for hydrogen. At the level of security, we do not know, for the hydrogen, we have to see what gives a tank pierced by bullet.


Drivel.
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Leo Maximus
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by Leo Maximus » 10/06/18, 14:54

Eric Dupont wrote:there is more future in the car than liquid nitrogen. for the liquid nitrogen the efficiency of the well at the wheel is likely to reach 60% against 45% for the hydrogen. liquid nitrogen is more easily stored in large quantities at lower cost with renewable energy is less true for hydrogen. At the level of security, we do not know, for the hydrogen, we have to see what gives a tank pierced by bullet.

Because no test would ever have been done? : Lol:

The first tests date back to the 50 years, when we began to develop cryogenic engines for rockets.

The conclusion is that a hydrogen tank is less dangerous than a gas tank because it contains much less energy (4 5 times less) and that hydrogen mixes very poorly with the air, 14,5 times more dense. See the famous example of the Hindenburg disaster.
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Eric DUPONT
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by Eric DUPONT » 10/06/18, 15:03

moinsdewatt wrote:
Eric Dupont wrote:there is more future in the car than liquid nitrogen. for the liquid nitrogen the efficiency of the well at the wheel is likely to reach 60% against 45% for the hydrogen. liquid nitrogen is more easily stored in large quantities at lower cost with renewable energy is less true for hydrogen. At the level of security, we do not know, for the hydrogen, we have to see what gives a tank pierced by bullet.


Drivel.


trollage
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Leo Maximus
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by Leo Maximus » 10/06/18, 15:11

Eric Dupont wrote:the car has hydrogen is dependent on platinum which is more expensive than gold at best it takes 3 times more than in a catalytic converter, but there are not yet and if so, the price of platinum will be worth 3 times more expensive.

In the meantime, the price of platinum has been falling for years.

The price of platinum today is 770 € an ounce: https://www.goldbroker.fr/cours/platine/eur

And that of gold is 1103 € an ounce: https://www.goldbroker.fr/cours/or/eur

Gold is 43% more expensive than platinum.
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by Remundo » 10/06/18, 20:26

right in this subject, a repetition!

the battery sector has a yield 3 times higher than hydrogen ...

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Source: Ulf Bossel, 1835 page
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by chatelot16 » 27/06/18, 22:41

I ask myself another question:

for me the car 100% electric does not suit me, not enough autonomy ... and without the autonomy to cross France with the existing gas station a car is unusable

what I think is useful is to make 10 or 15 first km with an energy better than petrol without weighing down the car so that it can cross France the days it is needed

you could think of putting a very small battery, but alas a small battery used at high power for a very short time has a life too short to be profitable

a small hydrogen tank emptied in 10 km has no problem of lifetime ... quickly empty a tank does not use it ... so we can make small ... a small electrolyser that values ​​photovoltaics that edf does not want to buy prohibitively expensive ... and a small tank of compressed hydrogen that makes the car turn during the first 10 km every day ... or even several times a day when one comes home to fill
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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by moinsdewatt » 24/04/19, 20:57

Automotive: China is heading for hydrogen

AFP published the 22 Apr 2019

Already a champion of electric cars with lithium-ion batteries, China wants to accelerate the emergence of the hydrogen engine: it pushes its manufacturers to this promising technology, targeting a million vehicles within a decade.

In mid-March, the government's annual "work report" was amended to include for the first time the objective of "promoting" the construction of charging stations for hydrogen vehicles. The country currently has about fifteen.

According to a government plan unveiled by the official press, Beijing is targeting 5.000 hydrogen vehicles on the roads next year, 50.000 by 2025 and a million in 2030 - a moderate objective given its colossal car market (28 million vehicles sold last year).

Hydrogen "is the next logical step in reducing (polluting) emissions, by solving some of the difficulties of electric vehicles, such as range and charging time, while reducing electricity consumption," observe Fitch analysts Solutions.

The technology involves boarding a tank storing compressed hydrogen, which is converted into electricity via a battery to power an electric motor.

The system offers an autonomy and a speed of recharging comparable to the filling of gasoline of a classic car, with the advantages of 100% electric vehicles (silence, absence of polluting emissions).

According to Xavier Mosquet, of the BCG cabinet, the hydrogen fuel cell could be "an interesting solution" for heavy goods vehicles, for which electric batteries (limited power, recharging time) are less suitable. Utility vehicles and buses could be preferred.

Spurred by the authorities, Chinese state builders are stepping up their preparations, like SAIC (which is already running hydrogen buses) and Great Wall Motors.

Specialist of urban 4x4, the latter prepares his first hydrogen car for 2020 before a commercial launch in 2023.

"No contradiction with electric cars! The two strategies are complementary: heavy goods vehicles will not be able to run purely on batteries," explains its vice-president, Zhao Guoqing, at the Shanghai auto show.

The fuel cell is still very expensive given the low volumes produced: for the moment, only the Japanese Toyota and Honda, and the South Korean Hyundai, have embarked on marketing.

"Chinese manufacturers will have to invest significant capital to develop or acquire the technologies. Toyota and Honda are leading the race," according to Fitch Solutions.

It is widely believed, however, that Beijing could propel hydrogen with generous subsidies and regulatory incentives, methods already used to drive off sales of electric cars.

Europe, it does not intend to miss the corner: Germany has launched a program to reach 400 hydrogen distribution stations by 2023 and Paris has adopted a plan of 100 million euros to support the industry hydrogen, focused in particular on the automobile.

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Re: The hydrogen car RE: the future?




by moinsdewatt » 24/04/19, 20:58

Nikola Motor invests to launch hydrogen heavyweights

Dim 31 / 03 / 2019 - A company moving forward.

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Hydrogen station


Even though Tesla still has plans to launch an electric heavy-duty battery-powered truck, the mass of the batteries and the slowness in recharging them will still remain obstacles that many truck drivers will find unacceptable. Fortunately, there is another solution, hydrogen. Nikola Motor has been developing for several years now to develop a zero emission super heavyweight using hydrogen, it announces today that it has equipped itself with a new test center for fuel cells and their various components. This is an investment of $ 16 million, which comes barely a week after the purchase of the land where the plant will be installed. It's in Coolidge, Arizona. And on its R&D site, Nikola Motor has just installed a hydrogen pump capable of delivering compressed gas at 700 bars.

So, Trevor Milton's company has already registered 13 000 pre-orders, and it gives itself every means to satisfy its customers. The hydrogen heavyweight will be a reality in a short time.

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https://www.moteurnature.com/29799-niko ... -hydrogene
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