Water doping plan Beetle

[combi_guy]

Hi,
I'm like you, Adrien, I also planned a cox engine, but 1200 cm3, the pb is the same, 4 flat cylinder, cooled air pre, I know this type of engine, and I have a combi, but the same engine in 2 liters, but I start with the cox,
the best, would be a 4 pot in 1, it is used, (there is a site about it), and I think I have one that will do,
I am interested in your work, I start mine in the spring, now, I prepare the ground: the plans

Guy

[Adrien]

Not so sure that it is out of the law (when there is only water eh)! And in free exhaust I will be spotted at 3km! already that the vehicle alone does not go unnoticed .....

[jcf]

Hi Adrien.
I like the quataplats and knows them well, and it seems to me that if you plan to mount a pot like the one you showed us in photo (4 1), the simplest way would be to place the reactor in the silencer (We just need the pantone pros tell us if the length of the pipes before is already too much heat loss). Thus the 4 cylinders will have the same pressure loss.
Because I'm not sure it's great in the long run for an engine to have one or two cylinders whose exhaust is braked, and the others not ...
Well, it's on, on a cox there is no room to change the muffler, and it may be seen, but to dig anyway.
Especially if you change the pipes that lead to the silencer, you will have to be very rigorous on the odds, history that everything goes well.
But by the way, you will not have any more heating, if you mount your reactors on the exhausts of the two most forward cylinders, no?
Good luck,
Jean-Christophe

[krissg29]

Hello

Adrien, the exhaust that I showed you is available at all the dealers of cox and derivative parts (combi, buggies, karmann, ...) of France and their commercials are in Super VW Magazine (publication in kiosk the 15 of month). The photo is an 4 1 collector with a silencer designed for 1 type motors (1200 / 1300 / 1500 / 1600) (the 1200 is different from the others). The collector can be sold alone. There are others on the same principle (replacement of the original silencer) for engines type 4 (1700 / 1800 / 2000). The advantage of these exhausts is, in my opinion, the presence of 2 rectilinear tubes quite simple to modify to put 1 or 2 reactors. There is also the possibility to put 1 reactor between the collector and the silencer but there the reactor is located at a meter of the outputs of the cylinder heads and as it needs very hot gases it is not ideal.

For my assembly, I mounted a reactor (13x305 tube 14 / 16 steel rod) on the output of the cylinder 4 (Christophe is the tube at the top right on the photo of Adrien exhaust) and I connected the geet gas output of the reactor to the original carburetor. That is to say that I have the tube (14-16 copper) coming from the reactor which goes down in the carbu by the air intake up to the level of the nozzle (assembly M.David). At the entrance of the reactor, I put a bubbler filled with half gasoline without water not connected to the exhaust: it sucks air.
At idle, in operation carbu, I have no bubble in the bubbler: normal, with the butterfly closed carburetor there is no depression at the nozzle.
By accelerating it starts to bubble and 3000 tr I measured 10 kpa of depression in the bubbler (the mano is graduated in kpa). If I do not gurgle in the commas, it must be 0.1 bar.
To try to highlight the operation of the reactor, I first heated the engine with the carb, bubbler disconnected. Then I plugged the bubbler and I disconnected the fuel supply to the carburetor (engine stopped less than 2 minutes). I restarted the engine and accelerated it to 3000 tr: it turned as long as there was fuel in the carb barrel (2 to 3 minutes) and it stalled.
The points I will review:
- connection of the reactor outlet under the original carburetor to have more depression and that it corresponds to the Pantone scheme
- warm up the bubbler: I did my tests in cold weather and the gasoline in the bubbler had to be about 10 ° C
- try to shorten the tube between the reactor and the pipe (currently about 60 cm).

Christophe, do you think that a too long tube length between the reactor and the pipe can generate a lot of heat (cooling of the geet gas) or loss of pressure?

[Adrien]

I had not thought to put the reactor directly in the silencer ... It is feasible? because otherwise I found it as a muffler for sale (more carrement least expensive!)



I circled the silencer in red. It seems to be easily modifiable and therefore easily hidden ... (not like the other chrome) In the following for heat loss, I can always properly isolate the ducts to the silencer.

For heaters, it will be necessary that I find a solution ... Knowing that if I made this vehicle it is to use it as a house and to be able to go everywhere ... (I intend to go to Iceland when it will drink water fairly stable ... without, I can not: it would be too expensive!)
For example, I was thinking of an auxiliary heater for a motorhome to plug into the cigarette lighter, so I can have hot even when the engine is cold ... And by disturbing well I can perhaps even have an engine turn off! (I don't want gas or gas heating)
And then at worst I can cover myself ... The warmth is only comfort, and if I wanted comfort I would not have chosen this vehicle;).

In fact I have a long project that is not just a trip from time to time ...

Here is the montage of Christophe (Kriss)



Try it can be putting the arrival of the mixture as ready as possible of the cylinders (even to put two can be, and drill at the level of the duplication of the pipe of double admission)

Motor2.jpg <- I did this quickly in yellow, then I'm afraid that there is too much length ... not for the loss of heat (you can always insulate well) but since the mixture must be sucked ...

To warm the bubbler, I had thought of a full flow to make a derivation of the oil circuit. Or with the exhaust gases, but I'm afraid it's too hot ... Or while doing as the "water cooling" PCs: a tank with an aquarium pump (cavitated around or under the bubbler ) and a water circuit that will surround the silencer (I think it can be a good compromise ...). It should be known how do those who turn LPG on 4 flat air (a guy next to my parents had it on his combi, but he moved, must I look for his number in my business ...)

Adrien

[Adrien]

Hi,
I'm like you, Adrien, I also planned a cox engine, but 1200 cm3, the pb is the same, 4 flat cylinder, cooled air pre, I know this type of engine, and I have a combi, but the same engine in 2 liters, but I start with the cox,
the best, would be a 4 pot in 1, it is used, (there is a site about it), and I think I have one that will do,
I am interested in your work, I start mine in the spring, now, I prepare the ground: the plans

Guy

I did not see your message ...
I also have a type4, but an 1700. But I think I sell it, because the spare parts are much too expensive ... And since I also have an 1600 and a single vehicle ...

Would you have a photo of the 4en1 you're talking about (so that I find the same )? the site is F4E no?

To start mine I'm waiting to put the engine in the vehicle (I have no roller coaster, and only I have not enough strength ...) to confirm that it rolls before installing doping water (for now I ride with the 1700)

re-adrien

[krissg29]

re-hello

yeah! it's my "montage"!
but it's still a trial DIY. Moreover the photo is the 1ère version with a carb instead of the current bubbler. when the system with bubbler will work, I will try again with the carburetor.

I saw a Belgian LPG-mounted combi: the owner had made his own steam regulator with a copper coil placed under the cylinders in the cooling air circuit and that was enough (about 60 to 80 ° C in temperature). look there)

And for your heating stationary, you can continue modifs and pantoniser a heating gasoline. After all it's just a burner!

[Adrien]

Yeah but it's going to consume more gasoline (same for electric heating but it's almost nothing)

[jcf]

the same for electric heating but it's almost nothing

So here I emit a serious flat ... I think that the small ceramic electric heaters on cigarette lighter must consume a lot, and if you intend to warm up at a standstill with, you have interest in having a battery of truck ...
In any case, if you calculate the energy needed to warm up, the energy drawn from the battery must have been produced by your gasoline engine (lower efficiency than a gas heater since 60 or 80% of energy bar in heat), go through a belt (again, 30% losses), go into the alternator (I imagine something like 10% losses) and be stored in the battery (again there are losses ). So in my opinion very very bad performance. In addition, there is the cost of permanent transport of heavy batteries.
And do not believe that the electricity of your battery is free, when it must be recharged, the alternator pulls much harder on the engine, hence overconsumption (see for example how the engine of the car that helps a other battery failure to start slows down when you plug the cables).
FYI, on electric cars (Peugeot 106, etc.), there is a gas tank .... for heating! It's not for nothing, huh. In addition it lug 400 kg of batteries, so it should not bother them!
In addition I read posts of owners of combis who had bought cigar lighters to defrost the windshield and a little heat because of the difficulty of having heating in winter, and although they were super disappointed.
And to conclude, the autonomous heating of my bus consumes at maximum speed 0,3 l of unleaded per hour. It is heating 30-40 cts euros the maximum hour, it is not necessarily very expensive.
Here you are ...
Otherwise for 4 exhausts in 1, I think that if your muffler is removable it's handy if you want to avoid immobilizing your car (if you use it every day). Because it's enough for you to have on one side your original silencer, on the other a silencer that you manufacture from scratch and which contains your reactor. Modularity assured! There is just the problem of the length of the front pipes which can cause the gases to be a bit too cold, but since there is the flow of 4 cylinders, it seems to me that there should be enough calories to transfer to the reactor (what do the experienced people think of the pantone?).
A+
JC

[combi_guy]

Would you have a picture of the 4en1 you're talking about (so that I find the same one)? the site is F4E no?

Adrien, there's this one for sale, but I do not know what kind of engine

<a href='http://annonces.flat4ever.com/detail.php?siteid=3020&catid=19' target='_blank'>http://annonces.flat4ever.com/detail.php?s...d=3020&catid=19</a>

also, I have an 4 in 1 but for 1 1200 engine

for my 1200, I think to modify the silencer of origin, to partition it, and to place there the reactor so as to recover the exhaust of the 4 cylinders

it's the first job, but I do not know the size of the reactor to build

Guy