Pantone engine results: we are hallucinating!

Water injection in thermal engines and the famous "pantone engine". General informations. Press clippings and videos. Understanding and scientific explanations on the injection of water into engines: ideas for assemblies, studies, physico-chemical analyzes.
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camel1
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by camel1 » 30/01/07, 14:03

Hi friends !

Visit this morning at Lycée Carnot to prepare the future manipulation, it will be great! :D

I asked Bernard (the teacher who deals with the power bench) if they did not have in their documentation the power curves of our engine ... after some research, he got me a RTA d 'a utility equipped with this model, but under another name : Shock: , finally everything is cut, displacement, power, bore, so no doubt :D

Here FINALLY this curve:

Image

After this visit to Carnot, I continued at the IUT, where I was able to develop the principle of vibration acquisition manipulation.
The manager told me that we could put a sensor in front of the teeth of the flywheel, which will allow us to measure the instantaneous speed, and thus be able to output a curve of accelerations during the combustion cycles.
With that, we will be able to reconstruct the global curve of the motor cycle, which interests us at the most, is not it? : Cheesy:

As this is a big move, and that the two students of Carnot BTS who have to work on this manipulation will not be there sooner, we have stopped the date of Wednesday 7 march ... I wish I had ( as you probably!) that it happens sooner (normally, it should be done this week ...) but hey ... I think it's worth it to wait a bit, and to prepare everything which revolves around ...
Especially since the guys of the IUT will be able to produce, at the end, a publication in scientific review, which will undoubtedly have another weight that a simple report of usher!

That's all for now, see you soon!

Michel
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Woodcutter
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by Woodcutter » 30/01/07, 21:32

I bow very low (Ouch my lumbago!) In front of the perfectionism of the development, really bravo ...

How far is the attention to detail, even in the name of the school ... (the cycle of Carnot, it tells you qqch : Mrgreen: )
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camel1
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by camel1 » 30/01/07, 23:24

Hi Bucheron!

Woodcutter wrote:How far is the attention to detail, even in the name of the school ... (the cycle of Carnot, it tells you qqch : Mrgreen: )


Is it a sign or an omen? (Castaneda) :D

As Jean Jacques Perouze said this morning, "Carnot, you know? ... the guy who is at the origin of the Roanne high school which bears his name, and who is incidentally attached to a certain cycle : Lol: "

Well if not, we made the point with Didier, and we will bring a small modification to the manip, on the good advice of Jean-Jacques:

According to him, for the test sequence "without pantone", it would be in your best interest to do it REALLY without, and not simply "OFF" system.

Indeed, according to him, the detractors will always have a nice game to say that the physical interposition of the reactor in the exhaust line produces a change of its "tuning", having an influence distorting the characteristics of the engine.

So the dry test will be done with the original line, without GV or reactor in the middle.

We will thus establish results closer to the reality of the before, then we will rest all the proto, and we will see for the : Cheesy:

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Michel
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by Woodcutter » 30/01/07, 23:50

Damage for the hour (hours?) Mechanics in the middle but it is true that it is more rigorous.
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camel1
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by camel1 » 31/01/07, 00:20

Woodcutter wrote:Damage for the hour (hours?) Mechanics in the middle but it is true that it is more rigorous.


Ben actually, the car to climb on deck, two clamps to tighten and two fittings, it should take between 1 / 4 time and 1 / 2 time :D
It's 10 easier than 205!

So work question, there is no pb!

Michel
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by Other » 31/01/07, 00:30

Hello
Indeed, according to him, the detractors will always have a nice game to say that the physical interposition of the reactor in the exhaust line produces a change of its "tuning", having an influence distorting the characteristics of the engine.


He is right with the original exhaust pipe the yield may be better than just a panton without water so the values ​​may be worse, (gap)
but if one pushes to the extreme one can also say that the restriction in the admission manifold also influences.
I find that it gives you a lot of work, just to prove beyond a doubt, in fact, values ​​that will change only slightly at full power .. (not recommended for a very old engine)
Because a restriction, exhaust or intake manifold, especially in the case of the Mercedes, or the piping was drawn very broad, the influence will be thin at 75% of the regime,
If we put the accent especially on the gain of power yes, but in our case it is mainly a question of yield, obviously that one is happy when one learns a gain of power with doping.
What I noticed when one gains in power one starts to lose in economy. A question of dosage to be determined
and find out why more water increases power
and why a certain precise dosage gives the best economy?

I think the first things to learn is the proper water and air ratio in the reactor that gives us the best performance and how far the temperature of the reactor influences, also whether there is an ideal regime and an ideal charge to get the most out of water doping.

On an engine installed on a bench it is easy to disassemble the tubing, but in a car it is less pleasant .. although on the 220 D there is room and as you have recently put the bolts are still tender ..

Andre
Last edited by Other the 31 / 01 / 07, 00: 39, 1 edited once.
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camel1
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by camel1 » 31/01/07, 00:39

Hi Andrew!

Andre wrote:Hello

He is right with the original pipe exhaust performance may be better than just a panton without water so the values ​​may be worse,
but if one pushes to the extreme one can also say that the restriction in the admission manifold also influences.
I find that it gives you a lot of work, just to prove beyond doubt, in fact values ​​that will change only slightly at full strength.
Andre


With this manipulation, we can compare with the first, where we measured "dry" with the pantone in the exhaust line.
We can take all the measure on the modification that this introduces, and as you say "this will give us the right time" ...

On a single point (3000 rpm 30kw), but it will already be a preview!

Michel
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lio74
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by lio74 » 31/01/07, 20:41

camel1 wrote:According to him, for the test sequence "without pantone", it would be in your best interest to do it REALLY without, and not simply "OFF" system.

Indeed, according to him, the detractors will always have a nice game to say that the physical interposition of the reactor in the exhaust line produces a change of its "tuning", having an influence distorting the characteristics of the engine.

So the dry test will be done with the original line, without GV or reactor in the middle.


good evening to you, diligent experimenters 8) : Cheesy:

it's clear .. it's a point not neglected all the same ... then you still have the original tubing ... so no problem!

houlala I also saw that it already speaks of scientific publication ... be careful not to go too fast ... "slowly but surely ..."
may need to have results on recent engines ... less than 10in nan ???
what do you think? all! : Wink:

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by Other » 31/01/07, 22:33

Hello
may need to have results on recent engines ... less than 10in nan ???
what do you think? all
!

Why, I think it's to look for the best result with the available engine is for comparison.
Because if we become selective in the choice of engines, it comes out every year new and with modifications.
and with the amount of stationary diesel engine, on agricultural machinery and boats ect ..
Doing this research belongs more to the big builders
which probably is already done, but not compatible with the line of thought of the panton, he launches into a ERG at large volume

In the immediate future it does not even recognize that a doping water on an old diesel works, so the choice is that we take a diesel best able to highlight the differrence, and I believe that the choice of Mercedes Benz is an ideal candidate to demonstrate, the name of this manufacturer in diesel still has some expertise ..

Andre
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lio74
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by lio74 » 02/02/07, 19:49

Andre wrote:
In the immediate future it does not even recognize that a doping water on an old diesel works, so the choice is that we take a diesel best able to highlight the differrence, and I believe that the choice of Mercedes Benz is an ideal candidate to demonstrate, the name of this manufacturer in diesel still has some expertise ..

Andre


Hi everybody!

you're absolutely right, for the show must be an engine that throws !!! with striking results ... that's what Camel1 doing and what I'm about to make my proto!

but to a published in scientific journal .... need a true experimental lab bench ... or it will be denied and never published, rigor in Science and Future or Science and Life ... :?

but you're right ... do they already acdcepter that it works!

@+
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"To do something is expensive, to do nothing will cost much more." Koffie Annan

next species endangered: Man ... and it will be good for him !!!

MAN IS A VERY DANGEROUS POLLUTION NATURAL!

 


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