Problem water supply for turbine Pelton hydro electricity

[Gilles 2B]

Hello,

I live in an isolated site in Corsica and I am not connected to any network, I drink the spring water collected at 2,5 km from the house, photovoltaic electricity, 2000 Battery amps 24 volts, bi-fuel diesel generator HVP, satellite internet and cell phone ...

I am installing a pelton turbine to no longer use my generator and I would like to connect it to my drinking water supply network but problem:
- Flow: about 3 cubic meters / hour
- Pressure: Falling height approximately 180 meters from the source
- Reserve: I have a tank of 75 cubic meters at mid-height is about 95 meters high or theoretical pressure about 9 bars.

I therefore plan to make a "bypass" at the level of the tank with a piloted solenoid valve which will send the water directly from the source to the turbine at a given time, ie at a theoretical pressure of 18 bars, which should do sing the pelton a little louder and give me enough electricity with the 1100W dynamo I installed.

The problem being that I don't know how the water will react when the passage is opened directly from the source to the turbine and if it will not simply fill the reserve tank "upside down". .

Is it necessary to put a non-return valve on the outlet of the tank?
will the pressure in the tank be enough to direct the water down?

Enlighten me, I thank you in advance!


Gilles

[dedeleco]

Indicate more clearly the "by-pass" assembly at the reserve tank, the pipe and turbine diameters.
Indicate what is currently working and what has been tried.
The pressures and flows are already strong and therefore pay attention to dangerous forces, valves and water hammers that break everything !!

[chatelot16]

it should 2 motorized valve: one to open to the turbine and another to close to the tank

the valve to the turbine is not essential, you can also close down at the turbine

avoid solenoid valves that close abruptly with a destructive blow on long pipes: I prefer a large motorized tap slowly

3m3 / h / 3600 = 8,33e-4 m3 / s
180m> 18bar = 1800000 Pa (N / m2)
theoretical power
1800000 Pa x 8,33e-4 m3 / s = 1500w

to get 1300w it will take a really good performance ... but a little more or a little less, there is enough to do

[Forhorse]

Rather than 2 valves we can simply use a valve 3 channels (motorized) it does both functions at the same time: open the direct passage and close the return to the reserve.

I also strongly advise the use of solenoid valves for this kind of application.
In addition to the risks of belier shots at closing (but there is EV closure progressive) they inevitably induce significant losses that are detrimental to the recovery of maximum energy.

[chatelot16]

75m3 of water make a non negligible energy storage

95m> 9.5bar = 950000Pa

75m3 x 950000Pa = 71250000 J
/ 3600 = 19791wh = 20kwh

it is worth to put a turbine on your tank with regulator opening the water only according to the necessary power, and turning 24h / 24 without need of battery! turbine can make a much stronger power if needed not too long, for example 4kw for 5heure!

in this case it would be necessary to put another turbine next to the basin using the power of the water coming from the source producing a constant power

[oli 80]

Good evening, about the production of electricity with the force of water here is another way https://www.econologie.com/forums/moteur-belier-t10092.html

I know it 's off topic, but this camera also works with water and it is also to push you to comment on this engine, the video is not mine I am not Latin American

here is a link with different types of turbines
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbine_hydraulique

the turgo turbine looks much like the pelton

[Gilles 2B]

Thank you all for your quick answers,

Being really not a specialist, I still need more details,

Chatelot, you explain to me that I have a potential reserve of 20 KW, IT'S BEAUTIFUL !!!, how can I recover this power or even run a turbine permanently with the bit of flow I have?

In addition, the reserve tank is more than a kilometer from the house so the installation (turbine) is far from the tank, which allows me to have the pressure, the supply pipe is 32 mm (outside ) or 1 inch (I believe) indoors, it is the drinking water supply pipe of the house and I just wanted to "divert" the water without going through the tank (thanks to my bypass) to increase fall height and then use the full fall height from the source to the house to run the turbine for a few hours every night to recharge my batteries.

If there is a better way, or if I can run a production system all the time, obviously it's much better ...

I am waiting for your support and advice in the development of this project.

Thank you again and see you soon, I hope.


Gilles

[Gaston]

Chatelot, you explain to me that I have a potential reserve of 20 KW, IT'S BEAUTIFUL !!!

No, of 20kWh.

how can I recover this power

It's an energy, not a power.
You can get 20kWh in 20 hours with an 1kW generator or as chatelot16 dir in 5 hours with an 4kW generator.
But (there is of course a but), it is necessary that the output flow of the tank is sufficient ...
For an 4kW generator, with 95 meters of elevation, it would take at least 20 m3 / h.

In addition, the tank is more than one kilometer from the house so the installation (turbine) is far from the tank, which allows me to have the pressure, the pipe is 32 mm (outside) ) 1 inch (I think) indoors,

I'm afraid it's too weak to pass 20 m3 / h ...

[Forhorse]

Without being a specialist (far from it) I would leave on a small turbine.
In my opinion, it is preferable to have a small turbine which runs 24 hours a day (the batteries acting as a buffer in the event of higher consumption) rather than a "big" which can only run for a few hours.

[Remundo]

Hello Gaston,

for your bypass, the pipe must be under load everywhere from the high point, without any leaks other than that of the turbine (the low point).

by its elevation situation, your tank makes you lose half of the potential energy: it's really a shame.

Personally, I would turbinate along the water (smaller turbine, generator too) with battery storage.

It's always expensive to get high peak power in hydraulics ... especially when you do not need it

The tank could be filled if necessary via an optional valve / valve along the penstock, piloted or not ...

@+