Biogas: heating + gas + compost gratis

Renewable energies except solar electric or thermal (seeforums dedicated below): wind turbines, energy from the sea, hydraulic and hydroelectricity, biomass, biogas, deep geothermal energy ...
Obelix
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by Obelix » 20/09/06, 10:06

Hello,

There are many sites giving examples on the web.
google => digesters

The nicest is:
http://www.eden-enr.org/spip/article.php?id_article=37

Or how with three francs six under recovering inexpensive energy.

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by Targol » 20/09/06, 10:36

davidbeniz wrote:
ok ok....

but the combustion of this gas does not differ from petroleum, and despite that it is economical, I suppose that it rejects harmful gases again and again, right ?? :(


Hi David,

And no, there is a huge nuance between what is produced by fossil fuels and fresh vegetables. I already explained this in this subject. I invite you to go and see, I'm too lazy to rewrite everything.

PS: Christophe, I think it would not be bad to write an article on this, the question falling down quite often. You can base yourself on my message in the thread linked above if you find it clear enough.
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by GREGNENE » 20/09/06, 12:52

If I understand correctly, the person who uses vegetable products to produce methane (for heating and running a generator for example) does not pollute ???
thank you for answering me clearly because I am lost
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by Former Oceano » 20/09/06, 13:13

We can estimate that we do not pollute (except N2O or CO emissions) if we use biogas because it comes from biological materials whose carbon they contain comes from the atmosphere.

Plants use atmospheric CO2 (or dissolved in water for aquatic plants) to produce organic matter and oxygen.

If we burn our organic materials before (wood stove for example) or after biological transformation (biogas, sludge from treatment plants, ...) we will just reinject into the atmosphere the CO2 that has been removed by them plants. Balance sheet 0.

If you use natural gas or petroleum products, you inject CO2 into the atmosphere that did not come from it! Hence the increase in CO2 levels, greenhouse effect, ... Brief pollution.
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by Targol » 20/09/06, 14:12

Not better !!!
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by denis » 20/09/06, 14:25

former oceanic wrote:We can estimate that we do not pollute (except N2O or CO emissions) if we use biogas because it comes from biological materials whose carbon they contain comes from the atmosphere.

Plants use atmospheric CO2 (or dissolved in water for aquatic plants) to produce organic matter and oxygen.

If we burn our organic materials before (wood stove for example) or after biological transformation (biogas, sludge from treatment plants, ...) we will just reinject into the atmosphere the CO2 that has been removed by them plants. Balance sheet 0.

If you use natural gas or petroleum products, you inject CO2 into the atmosphere that did not come from it! Hence the increase in CO2 levels, greenhouse effect, ... Brief pollution.



good news at last !! then oil does not pollute! it comes from organic matter, have made the co2 consumed by prehistoric trees and plants : Cheesy: :?: : Shock: it deserves reflection, right?
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by Targol » 20/09/06, 14:59

denis wrote:good news at last !! then oil does not pollute! it comes from organic matter, have made the co2 consumed by prehistoric trees and plants : Cheesy: :?: : Shock: it deserves reflection, right?


Rhhoooo, but no, Denis, are you doing it on purpose or what? :D

Well, since you were too lazy to follow the link I put 4 messages above, here is a copy:
Targol wrote:(...) What Philippe does not seem to have understood is that the atmosphere is a natural reservoir of CO2. What is problematic is when we desynchronize the CO2 capture and restitution cycles from this tank.

small explanation (simplified)
  • wood heating: During its growth, the plant captures CO2 in the reservoir (the amosphere) and uses it to build itself.
    During cremation, the CO2 that was captured during the shoot is released into the amosphere.
    We are therefore faced with a short cycle: the CO2 captured during 50ans is released in 1h, 50 years later. Now, 50 years in the cycle of our atmosphere, it's innocuous.
    Note that bio-fuels (excluding refining and except diesel tractors) like HVB follow the same short cycle.
  • hydrocarbons: Plants that grew millions of years ago have, in the same way as today, punctured some of the CO2 from the atmosphere.
    They did not burn (so they did not return the CO2 they had taken to the atmosphere) but then fell, through a succession of geological phenomena, turned into hydrocarbons.
    So we end up with, underground, the result of millions of years of capturing CO2 by millions of plants. And here's the rub: these phenomenal quantities of CO2 pumped into the atmosphere by millions of plants for millions of years are released into the atmosphere in a century. There is a huge desynchronization of capture and recovery cycles that the atmosphere can not handle.

That was a bit long, but I hope it will help some to understand the CO2 component of hydrocarbons.
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by Woodcutter » 20/09/06, 15:21

davidbeniz wrote:[...] but the combustion of this gas does not differ from petroleum, and in spite of that it is economic, I suppose that it rejects again and always harmful gases, no ?? :(
Any combustion of a hydrocarbon chain product produces CO2, but if this fuel comes from biomass, it participates in a "short" carbon cycle compared to fossil fuels.


former oceanic wrote: I don't think our short gut makes us produce methane. [...]
If, between 1 and 1,5 l per day for an adult, and more for a man than for a woman.
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by Woodcutter » 20/09/06, 15:23

Well ... : Mrgreen: I see that I was not alone in the explanations : Wink:
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by Woodcutter » 20/09/06, 15:36

Targol wrote:
denis wrote:good news at last !! then oil does not pollute! it comes from organic matter, have made the co2 consumed by prehistoric trees and plants : Cheesy: :?: : Shock: it deserves reflection, right?


Rhhoooo, but no, Denis, are you doing it on purpose or what? :D [...]
I would be you, I would not be so sure ... :| (Cf. the passage on the biodiversity of marshy moors for mosquitoes : Shock: )
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