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lio74
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Éconologue good!
posts: 333
Registration: 15/03/06, 23:16
Location: Haute-Vienne and SAVOY

by lio74 » 01/06/06, 10:51

Christine wrote:To come back to the eco-village project, I notice that we often had on this forum messages from people with projects and trying to recruit but it always stopped there.

When we do a quick search on the web, we quickly realize that this phenomenon is widespread and that many "big projects" end up giving birth to mice.

.............

So, the purpose of this post is not to break Thunderman's project but just to point out that all these projects remain in a certain artistic vagueness and are sometimes even a bit suspicious.

In short, the idea in theory is attractive but the reality ...


it is on we drifted a bit of the subject ... so for the choice of energy, like "who ??" said it must be played on the multitude of alternative energy available ...

Christine is right, we must pay attention to the excesses, this is not a sect or a group of Thai pedophile Thunderman wants to create!

I think that's project is pretty much ponderously ... for it to launch on all forum he finds ... it's not an easy task to manage :!:

I want to emphasize that he still found 2 allies, me on and Camel1 (I think so) who has already mounted a mother asso

there are already a number of ecodomains in France ... a small number compared to Germany or Finland and Denmark ...

what we see once again on the forum it is that there is a collective consciousness ... remains to create cohesion!

the final idea of ​​Thunderman (school and all .....) is a dream to which he must cling .. the dream is a motor :!:

now it is necessary to start to build a coop on a site on which living permanants (5 or 6) live ... that they open their door to let people see ...
we need a departure, a mother infrastructure, rallied people to the project without forcing them to live on the spot
I think it's important to note that before setting up a village you have to start a co-op to get finance and food and then have a lot of people joining the association ... people coming from the city to start to share their know-how, equipment, harvests ...

you have to create a financially viable place :!:

voalou the loulous !!! : Lol: 8)

personally I still have a year of study to do .... after I do not want to be a victim of this system cons suro ... I want to share, learn, build, cultivate .... find the true values ​​of life on Earth our nursing mother :!: I want to respect her and have the right salary for my work!

the motivation is there ... I think that sooner or later thunderman's project (which is almost identical to mine) will see the light of day, if not others will do it too ...

Here is a concrete example in France: http://www.ecodomaine.org/ecofestival20 ... stival.php
I will be there as a volunteer animator!
@ +++ the econololo : Cheesy:
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"To do something is expensive, to do nothing will cost much more." Koffie Annan
next species endangered: Man ... and it will be good for him !!!
MAN IS A VERY DANGEROUS POLLUTION NATURAL!
Thunderman
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I learn econologic
posts: 19
Registration: 26/05/06, 02:02

by Thunderman » 08/06/06, 07:23

Hi everyone, I created a forumit will be easier for me to talk about the project forums at the same time ... I hope he will please you:

http://www.lemondeestanous.superforum.fr

Good visit : Cheesy: !
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lio74
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posts: 333
Registration: 15/03/06, 23:16
Location: Haute-Vienne and SAVOY

by lio74 » 08/06/06, 18:31

Thunderman wrote:Hi everyone, I created a forumit will be easier for me to talk about the project forums at the same time ... I hope he will please you:

http://www.lemondeestanous.superforum.fr

Good visit : Cheesy: !

:D this is a good idea : Idea: : Lol:
I'm going for it, finally this click of the mouse : Cheesy:

Camel's project looks good to go far ...

it's useless to go against the current and it's not the best to be carried in the mass, you just have to take the momentum to create a parallel flow ... which will grow gradually!

@ ++
0 x
"To do something is expensive, to do nothing will cost much more." Koffie Annan

next species endangered: Man ... and it will be good for him !!!

MAN IS A VERY DANGEROUS POLLUTION NATURAL!
Logan
I understand econologic
I understand econologic
posts: 62
Registration: 25/03/03, 11:45

The international situationist

by Logan » 09/06/06, 21:35

Hi Thunderman

I will make some criticisms about your project of ecological community. I rely on my own experience which unfortunately left me a rather bitter memory.
First of all, I advise you if you have not done so yet, to stay in several different communities in order to forge a good experience.
Many projects collapse not because of the ecological choices on which everyone is pretty much in agreement but because of relationship problems between members and incursions too invasive some in the private field of others.
Contrary to what you seem to believe, individualism is not opposed to the realization of common projects. Respect for the individual and therefore his opinions is the sole guarantee of the success of any community project. People agree to share only if they feel that their own particularism is respected. In the first place we live for ourselves, to blossom and fulfill ourselves, not for others (at least not without compensation). We must not forget this basic sociological fact.
And yes ... we do not escape that, social problems arise in any human organization, whether it is ecological or not. It is in fact the major challenge of any project of refounding society.
To paraphrase the situationist philosopher Raoul Vaneigim, I would say that any establishment of an organization generates its own authoritarianism and that is why we must be aware of it in order to limit its liberticidal effects.

Except when I read you, I note terms that make me a little cringe, I will seem a little harsh in my comments but it's experience:

Ethics, love, psychological help (big (big) words that do not mean much, everyone having their personal ethics of life and interpersonal relationships, in any case, it does not have much to do with an ecological project, you have to stay in the concrete in my opinion)

fight vice (what is vice? Idea largely relativistic, vice for one is not always for the other)

To the extent that another member joins the group, a resident will have the opportunity to leave us if he wants (if I understand correctly we can not leave the community when we want, we need a replacement, sectarian drift and clashes in perspective)

The property shared by him (the one who leaves) will of course be recoverable. (That I tell you right now that it will not work, because it is necessary to think that your good of departure will have evolved thanks to the contributions of the community.So either each one keeps his goods from the departure or what is put in It is not recoverable, but if everyone retains the right to recover their contributions, your community will not evolve because no one will want to invest or care for the good of others for fear of losing the result of their work one day.)

Decisions will be made unanimously unless opponents' arguments are unethical or community-based. (So, you have a big problem, which decides that it's unethical or principled - the majority - the leader - the great guru - the principle of unanimity must apply unconditionally or It is a risk to take because someone can block the whole group for reasons that are not valid in your eyes but you have to know what you want We are libertarian or we do not The unanimity is unconditional, otherwise it is a sect at the mercy of the first who will be able to manipulate the opinions of others and throw the shame on the black sheep. qualified at the outset, at least one is warned.If some do not agree, it is because the proposal has not been sufficiently discussed, explained and amended, point.)

It is excluded that a special place is reserved for religious beliefs. They will simply be considered as they define themselves, ie "beliefs". All propaganda is to be avoided, especially if it is against the ethics defined here (you already impose your own definition of religion and the limit to its harmful effect according to you: Propaganda. talk about proselytism There are many other forms of "beliefs" that induce propaganda from their members: what about political activism? Philosophical? economic? esoteric? even ecological? and to quote your own words "Ethics The simplest is to define what is in the domain of the community (the common rules of life and ecological constraints) and to separate them from the private sphere where everyone is free to exercise "activism" in the field that If you start by stigmatizing people who have a religion, you enter into a rather radical form of atheist propaganda and do not show yourself very open)

School. (I'm surprised you're talking about this topic.) It seems to me that it does not have much to do with an eco-village, it's a domain that must remain in the private sphere. of internal school but when I read sentences like "ethical differences" "... to find myself unsociable and helpless in the face of the system" I wonder if you measure well the range of certain words.You speak a little like a politician who repeats the pompous phrases heard at the local bar without really knowing what it is, in any case, the impression that it gives.)

Real life (You definitely do not choose your titles, the concept of "real life" does not exist, it would be more honest to say "how I see life" it would avoid reducing the debate to your only vision of the world necessarily reductive, I hope you are aware at least ... In any case it would be a proof of openness to others.
Then you say "each member will naturally transmit his knowledge to the one who asks him" and further "Each member will have to transmit his donations his knowledge to the children of the group who will come to see him" Sorry but the sharing, it is not decreed. It depends on the desire and the bonds that are formed between the members of the community. You can possibly hope that there will be sharing (we wish you) but you must above all attach yourself to creating bonds of trust and brotherhood and, I am sorry to tell you, it is a personal approach that does not can be imposed by your will alone. For someone who wants to create a fraternal community, you use the imperative far too much, do you only realize that this is crippling?

These remarks aside that are probably to be put on the account of inexperience and a big enthusiasm with slightly authoritarian tendency, I hope that you will be able to put your project in work because this world needs all the good wills if we want to avoid running right in the wall at the end (but is not it already too late?).
I think you absolutely have to spend more time in eco-villages or even in more radical ecological communities. This is essential to accumulate experience and prevent your project from failing.
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Thunderman
I learn econologic
I learn econologic
posts: 19
Registration: 26/05/06, 02:02

by Thunderman » 12/06/06, 23:24

Thank you for your advice! I will consider most of them for the new project update. However, I do not hide that it sports a dream which is mine, and that it addresses only those who recognize themselves there. That's why it seems strict. However you are right, it is without doubt a little too much. Some things have already changed since I posted the project here. I recall that he is currently on the forum that I just created: http://lemondeestanous.superforum.fr/viewsujet.forum?t=5

thanks again : Wink: !
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Christophe
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Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
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by Christophe » 14/06/06, 23:55

The subject continues here: https://www.econologie.com/forums/projet-eco ... t1976.html

And at the request of its creator I close this one.
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