New tractor running on biofuels

[delnoram]

No more ugly polluting tractors with this prototype under test

[Flytox]

Hello delnoram

Do not see the whip to motivate the team ....
Some will say that motivation is not what it used to be ...
A+

[Christophe]

Pffff ... it's smart ... in addition it's not very profitable at the CO2 / Cv level ...

[Christophe]

Good without joking ... if we wanted, at the present time, to replace all agricultural tractors by horses or oxen (in power equivalence on the basis of 1 cv "steam" = 1 animal),ecological impact would be disastrous (as much in CO2 as in soil levels) on the condition of finding enough surface to provide their fodder ... This obviously taking into account the global balance of each solution.

But agriculture is what provides fuel ... human ... therefore essential and with the petro-dependence of current argiculture, a severe energy crisis would have far more serious consequences than being forced to take public transport ...

In the case of agriculture there are no real alternatives ...

[stef5555]

No more ugly polluting tractors with this prototype under test

prototype???

I find rather old model no ??

[petromax]

Hello,

Good without joking ... if we wanted, at the present time, to replace all agricultural tractors by horses or oxen (in power equivalence on the basis of 1 cv "steam" = 1 animal)

If animal traction is not the solution, its energy balance is nevertheless a little higher than you seem to present it.

The equivalence 1 Cv "vapor" = 1 animal is not correct, or at least not complete. Without going into the details of the concept of work (there are many publications on this subject which often conclude that the equivalence of 1 steam CV = 1 horse was a good commercial argument ...), try to pull a plow with a drill of 736 Watts

Studies based on the muscle mass of draft horses have shown that the maximum power of an average draft horse can be estimated at around 30 Ch DIN. Power which is of course not usable full time.

"Modern" agricultural equipment is beginning to be developed for draft horses.

http://www.pferdestark.org/Franzoesisch ... esisch.htm

Greetings

[Christophe]

1) 30 hp? It seems important to me since it is the power necessary for a vehicle (more than 1T) to go to 100 km / h ... A horse is very far from moving 1 T (its own weight included obviously) at 100 km / h ...

Do you have any sources for these "studies"? On the other hand I agree on the fact that a real horse can give more than a cv steam ... but the cv steam may have been defined according to the average work given by a horse over a day (10 to 12 h).

2) As for the analogy with the drill, a mechanical Watt is a mechanical Watt and with a great reduction there is no reason that it does not advance a plow ... but rare are the plows that require 1 cv ... it's more like 10 to 30 cv ...

3) The fact is, and I agree with you, thata real horse is a "concentrated" couple... or in engine to have a minimum of torque it takes power (or vice versa) or the need for greater power.

It would take precise figures of a horse's pulling force and the average speed of a plow to estimate "real" power.

4) Last thing: There are already 10 to 30 hp which are taken by the mechanical tractor just to move forward "itself" without providing any work to the tool.

Something that is not included in the animal equivalence (we only count what it provides). In this case your remark on the equivalence of 30 hp "tractor" would be judicious ... on condition that it is not pure work ....

[Christophe]

To finish my reasoning: there are not 36 solutions for the post-oil era if we don't want to starve.

1) Develop real biofuels in short cycle (that is to say not the escrofuels which consume energetically speaking more oil than what it provides)

2) Find new methods of cultivation or rather find methods! See the semi under cover developed in South America. See: https://www.econologie.com/annuaire/inde ... =1&id=0006

3) Spoil food less (30% of the meat produced in the USA is not consumed by humans..Thanks Mmmmmmmmmmmerde and his MacMerde)

4) Consume "simpler" natural products, ie requiring fewer resources.

Anyway ... there's a job ...

[petromax]

1) 30 hp? It seems important to me since it is the power necessary for a vehicle (more than 1T) to go to 100 km / h ... A horse is very far from moving 1 T (its own weight included obviously) at 100 km / h ...

Do you have any sources for these "studies"? On the other hand I agree on the fact that a real horse can give more than a cv steam ... but the cv steam may have been defined according to the average work given by a horse over a day (10 to 12 h).

I was talking about power maximale (available shortly) calculated from muscle mass (sorry I did not find the article in question), I found here
http://fitnesscar.free.fr/chiffres_prop ... es_chevaux an estimate at 15 Ch DIN ...

2) As for the analogy with the drill, a mechanical Watt is a mechanical Watt and with a great reduction there is no reason that it does not advance a plow ... but rare are the plows that require 1 cv ... it's more like 10 to 30 cv ...

1 plow 1 body and 2 hp (not 2 drills )it's possible : http://www.dailymotion.com/related/6360 ... 06_animals
It was also totally common in our campaigns 60 years ago

3) The fact is, and I agree with you, thata real horse is a "concentrated" couple... or in engine to have a minimum of torque it takes power (or vice versa) or the need for greater power.

It would take precise figures of a horse's pulling force and the average speed of a plow to estimate "real" power.

Indeed, but it is especially necessary to take into account the "time" factor.
Below an article resuming the studies of the CGO (Compagnie Générale des Omnibus) on animal traction.
http://hippotese.free.fr/blog/index.php ... x-de-trait
Just as for an internal combustion engine (and undoubtedly even more) the only criterion of power is not sufficient to "characterize", other data is needed.

4) Last thing: There are already 10 to 30 hp which are taken by the mechanical tractor just to move forward "itself" without providing any work to the tool.

It is a marketing point, there are in agricultural equipment 6 different standards used for the determination of the power according to the place of the measurement (from gross engine power with minimum of accessories to net power take-off), the power actual traction is also affected by the rate of tire slip which is far from negligible. The draft horse "passes power better" for example in skidding in the undergrowth and affects the vegetation less.

Something that is not included in the animal equivalence (we only count what it provides). In this case your remark on the equivalence of 30 hp "tractor" would be judicious ... on condition that it is not pure work ....

As for cultural practices (TCS and sowing under cover ...) I fully agree with you. These practices require less engine power, I would find it interesting to test them with animal traction in territories that are suitable (highly fragmented plot, small farms ...)

[damienf]

Not bad traction.
It's like everywhere;
if we take something ill-suited, the results are not good:
a large tractor (current case today) can have an energy balance of 25 / 30l of GO / HA up to three times, depending on how the farmer presses the fungus, passes once or three or four to plant a crop; but today, farmers no longer say "did you see how my tractor plows fast and deep" ... There are still a few that are an exception, but the price of GO has become a deterrent and diesel / vegetable oil must prove itself