Solar thermal collector autoconstruit: what solution?

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BobFuck
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by BobFuck » 12/11/12, 18:43

by the way, do they burst with frost or not, these pipes?
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by cortejuan » 12/11/12, 18:58

Hi,

I also have several questions: What about the sludge in the pipes? As polyethylene is porous to oxygen, sludge must be able to form there, which is not the case with copper.

Another question: if I drain in the evening to avoid the risk of bursting, as my sensor will be on a roof at 3-4 meters in height, I must use a pump capable of pushing the water to this height. However I use minipumps of 15 watts and I use the closed circuit effect so that the height has no influence.

Nobody talks about the use of glycol yes I know it is not too ecological and in my case a leak would be catastrophic because the glycol would mix with the water of my reserve also used to water. But that would avoid any risk of bursting and avoid daily emptying.

cordially
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by chatelot16 » 12/11/12, 19:35

you should never say glycol at all

there is ethylene glycol, and propylene glycol

one (of course the cheapest) is toxic ... the other and usable as a food additive

I do not specify exactly which one because I always confuse them ... but a stroke of gogol will answer exactly the question

there are tips to avoid wasting power with a powerful pump: the downpipe has a small air intake 20cm above the water level: when the circuit is full a weak pump is enough ... when the pump stops the bubbles rises in the descent, the circuit reverses and empties

there must be 2 pumps: a powerful one to fill the circuit, and which stops when it is full and a weak one to circulate

even a porous oxygen pipe does not make mud!

what makes mud in the heating circuits is oxygen which causes the pipes to rust, radiator or steel boiler ... if the circuit is perfectly sealed with oxygen, the steel is not attacked and it doesn't make mud

but in the case of this solar collector everything will be plastic ... and even if there is a cast iron pump in the circuit, it is not a closed circuit like a central heating: it goes in a large tank
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by chatelot16 » 12/11/12, 19:41

BobFuck wrote:by the way, do they burst with frost or not, these pipes?


polyethylene pipes resist frost: flexible enough to support the difference in diameter

I like the automatic emptying to optimize the heat sensor function: recover all the hot water when the sun stops instead of letting the already hot water cool down

even if the pipes of 16 support the gel I like the rigid pvc pipes to make the collector: those you have to empty them
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by dedeleco » 12/11/12, 20:53

BobFuck wrote:by the way, do they burst with frost or not, these pipes?


personal experience on these thin and inexpensive pipes, over more than 12 years in 3 gardens 83, 91, 77, as drip:
passing over it repeatedly with wheelbarrows and feet, after they no longer resist frost, because split in a few rare places in the bottom where the water stagnates without the slightest trace of air for meters !!!

But if there is a little air in it with the water, they resist frost, even after treatment under the wheelbarrows, since I never empty them for the winter however little, just zero pressure with some air !!

I had a lot more problems with rodents that cut their teeth, in the spring, with small fine holes, which squirt on restarting !!!

Anyway, these inexpensive, low pressure, 1 Bar hoses can be easily changed with fittings, in seconds !!

The white limestone contained in the water is deposited mainly in the drip nozzles, especially at the end of the pipes, and much less in the pipes.
But there is never any sludge, even with the m3 of water passing through it.

It is a very inexpensive solution and it is not necessary to have the pipes attached, just attached to the black background, thermal convection under a plastic film of greenhouse is sufficient to transmit heat.
We can also pour these well spaced pipes over a few cm, in anything black (blackened with soot or charcoal, which is used to make Indian ink), ranging from cement, to glue of all kinds, even crushed newspaper into paste and full of wood graphite which becomes very rigid and very light when dry, to end up in melted plastic, for example from bottles recovered in the garbage.

Le panel of paper or cardboard in sheets or crushed (or cellulose wadding) mixed with graphite black (burnt wood) and wood glue (fish in fact), with a simple wire frame, once dry and painted is very rigid, light, thermal insulation underneath naturally, ecological and very inexpensive. Protected from water, by paint and plastic film for greenhouse or mylar, it will resist very long at the price of the little pipe in it: 5 to 10 € per m2.
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by BobFuck » 12/11/12, 21:23

> polyethylene pipes resist complete freezing

OK (I would still have a big doubt about the fittings and everything that is not the famous tube) but the drainback is anyway a very good idea to keep hot water warm ...

I am considering this reflection for my next hut, so what would interest me is a roof in sensors. A standard mechanical tile roof costs around 50 € / m², removing the simple and quick solar roof to self-build at the same prices would be perfect, in this case it costs nothing!

I feel it is doable.

In this case, since the sensor costs nothing and we have plenty of it, no matter what it is, there is no longer any need to drill, with good insulation, a stock of a few m3 of water is enough to endure a few gray days while waiting for the sunny day.

An insulator, by the way:

http://www.eco-bricolage.com/lot-16-dal ... LISSE1.cfm

Or glass wool ...

Then the tubes.

Well, the tubes are placed on something ... how to put fewer tubes (ie, not joined)?

- Direct on black painted insulation slabs?

We rely on air to transfer heat between places without tubes, and tubes. It's not terrible. Unless it is also used as an air sensor (why not).

- On insulating tiles covered with a reflective material?

We want the light that hits the "mirror" to have a second chance to find a tube. But it doesn't work all the time ...

- Black sheet?

The light which misses the tube heats the sheet which heats the tube by conduction (which supposes a fixing by an adhesive not too insulating ...) and also via the air.

- Corrugated reflective sheet?

For a satellite dish to work well, you need to monitor the position of the sun, so no. You should see what it looks like ...
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by chatelot16 » 12/11/12, 21:56

no illusion ... this kind of economic sensor will help heat a greenhouse at 10 ° C ... not heat a house in winter!

it can not go up in temperature to heat the holes at dedeleco

at home I see rather that to get out of the dictatorship of the red tiles, expensive and ineffective since it is necessary to put a rain shield underneath

a good old corrugated sheet is less expensive and much more waterproof than the tiles ... alas refused for stupid question of aesthetics ... with the solar collector function in addition, it goes from the slum category to the ecological category!
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by antoinet111 » 12/11/12, 22:21

Hello guys, who knows the prices of zinc sheets sold in particular to be pegged?
it is weldable one on the other with a spacer for example, to circulate the water in a thin layer.
ou
it would be possible to fold sheets to take the form of crenels and to weld the edges, to make pipes with an extruder and to weld copper fittings to make the arrivals and exits in PER.
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by antoinet111 » 12/11/12, 22:25

the M² about 20 to 30 € per sheet.
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I vote for the writing of concrete post and practicality.

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by cortejuan » 12/11/12, 22:34

Hi,

interesting all that.

Another suggestion, the reformed double glazing (yes I come back to it) could be used by using the space between the two panes to transport water. One of the panes is painted black, the spacer is drilled to place two end caps, one for the entry, the other for the exit. I do not know if it will be effective but it will be aesthetic. This kind of glazing is fairly easy to find in window installers.


cordially
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