Electric car: physical limits and overall balance

Cars, buses, bicycles, electric airplanes: all electric transportation that exist. Conversion, engines and electric drives for transport ...
moinsdewatt
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by moinsdewatt » 30/07/12, 13:24

toto65 wrote: .....
2- the cost of maintenance of the electric car estimated at zero
it seems to me too little.

Philippe, what are your doubts? the annual cost?


Battery change after how many km?
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by Philippe Schutt » 31/07/12, 07:55

from column F you add fixed sums, so if you vary the annual mileage it does not change the cost.
in column C some costs are counted once too much.
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by toto65 » 31/07/12, 17:11

Battery change after how many km?

After 200 000km or 10 years

Ok Philippe, well done, I'll correct.
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by bamboo » 06/08/12, 11:16

citro wrote:1 / I will confirm my pre-booking of the MIA

Hello Citro,

I re-browse this thread and I saw that you wanted to reserve the MIA (in 2011 I think).
Did you do it ? And so, did you receive it? A priori yes, because it is now seems produced.

For my part, I tried an ION and I was totally surprised by the covers.
I knew that the torque of an electric motor was very good, but I thought that 90 km / h accelerations would be very limited. Well, in fact, not at all! This is no problem to mingle with the traffic of a fast lane! (since it was the fear of a lot of people here).
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by I Citro » 14/08/12, 16:47

Sorry Bamboo, The MIA is no longer on the agenda ...
And since Madame tried the Ion, she prefers it.
I like the Ion a lot, but for our current uses, the MIA would be sufficient and more efficient.
As our 2 106 electric work, for now, no need to change.

And then the scoot'elec is a pleasure as soon as the weather allows it.

I wish you a lot of pleasure in Ion (and a fast delivery).
You did well to jump on the promotion unless 11.000 € :P
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by bamboo » 17/08/12, 20:58

Yes, I understand that you prefer to keep cars that work. I do the same !
I did not have the pleasure to test the mia but it would have also been enough. It's just that its price becomes less interesting than the ion 8)

citro wrote:Sorry Bamboo, The MIA is no longer on the agenda ...
And since Madame tried the Ion, she prefers it.
I like the Ion a lot, but for our current uses, the MIA would be sufficient and more efficient.
As our 2 106 electric work, for now, no need to change.

And then the scoot'elec is a pleasure as soon as the weather allows it.

I wish you a lot of pleasure in Ion (and a fast delivery).
You did well to jump on the promotion unless 11.000 € :P
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by RIAZ » 12/10/12, 11:42

Hello everybody

Sad news ... for all those who do not get married intensely!

BETTER PLACE would have lead in the wing. That's what it's like to be late for a war ....
It's here : http://www.moteurnature.com/actu/uneactu.php?news_id=26680
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by Did67 » 12/10/12, 15:54

The article is still a little bitchy on some aspects:

- it is obvious that in this case (exchange of batteries), the solution is not to buy several batteries, but to rent one

- the battery then becomes like the old milk bottles: we make an empty bottle, the sation recharges it, you leave with another full ... You do not care that the bottle is scratched, dented ...

- I seemed to read that the battery of the ZOE (which is rented) is "plug and play" (interchangeable very quickly; therefore apparently, technically, we can therefore do, contrary to what the article implies) .

That said, I do not have an opinion on Better Place. It's just one or the other point of view of this article that surprises me ...

And I am not saying that setting up such a system is easy. Even if again, "factories costing millions", that seems surreal to me. Assuming it's standardized, I don't see what would prevent a sort of "Norauto", with a lift. You roll over it, click / clack, we unclip, we reclipse, you go to the cash register! Kind of like a McDrive of the battery. Millions ??? Yes. As much as McDO. Did this hinder the development of McDO ...

No, it makes me think of bad arguments of those who will still cry to the government when the gasoline will increase!

The challenge: to impose a standard on all manufacturers before everyone has developed his own. Once again, Europe is lagging behind and should impose!
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by Gaston » 12/10/12, 16:23

Did67 wrote:The article is still a little bitchy on some aspects:

- it is obvious that in this case (exchange of batteries), the solution is not to buy several batteries, but to rent one
What the article means is that in this case, you have to make more batteries than cars.

Did67 wrote:- the battery then becomes like the milk bottles of old: we make an empty bottle, recharge it, you leave with another full ...
But the filling time is not the same as for the milk bottle.
To be able to supply 1 bottle on time if it takes 8 hours to fill up, you have to have a stock of bottles.

Did67 wrote:- I seemed to read that the battery of the ZOE (which is rented) is "plug and play" (interchangeable very quickly; therefore apparently, technically, we can therefore do, contrary to what the article implies) .
The article does not say that we can not do it, he says that if we do, the vehicle + removable battery is heavier (therefore has a lower autonimie) that a vehicle with integrated battery.

Did67 wrote:Even if again, "factories costing millions", that seems surreal to me. Assuming it's standardized, I don't see what would prevent a sort of "Norauto", with a lift. You roll over it, click / clack, we unclip, we reclipse, you go to the cash register!
The idea of ​​Better Place was that, but fully automated ... hence the millions :?
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by RIAZ » 13/10/12, 10:03

Did67 wrote:- it is obvious that in this case (exchange of batteries), the solution is not to buy several batteries, but to rent one


This evidence condemns BETTER PLACE on the field ...

This system multiplies the number of batteries by a factor that I do not know but which is necessarily at least equal to 2 (2 batteries for a car at the time of the exchange) and certainly much higher for the entire logistics flow. Already the cost of the battery weighs heavily in the purchase or lease it will not fix things ....
The shorter the cooldown, the less the need forIn progress batteries is important, ... but more charging systems are expensive! How hard to be modern ....

If in the business plan from BP there was the comparison with milk bottles, that confirms that people who have money, put it anywhere. Let's acknowledge that losing it with MADOFF is not much smarter and remember that a bottle of milk (even organic) can not charge 250 amps under 200 Volts and carbonize the milk pump! It's nerd to be charred when you ambition the ZE ....

All this is based on the idea, carefully maintained by the lobbies of all hairs and their gazettes, that the problem of VE is autonomy .....

More generally, as long as the objective is not to offer a vehicle accessible to the greatest number (division of the price by 2 even 3), the infrastructures will not be financeable. We must see the face of RENAULT dealers who have imposed, at their expense, equipment and training for EVs they do not prepare to sell!

Only the Pharaohs could afford pyramids for themselves ...

The fall in prices is not on the agenda, outside the sell-off periods of PEUGEOT, because the manufacturers cling, like mussels to their bouchots, to the idea of ​​a high margin market and they will die.
The experience of the sinking of KODAK seems to be of no use to anyone ...

Moreover, we must not forget that a mass distribution of EVs would reveal the real contradictions of this option. It is likely that they are known on the upper floors of the builder's headquarters and the corridors of the ministries. So we pretend to be active for the future by on the spot.
Le on the spot was visible Porte de Versailles these last days: very clever one who could list the big changes that he found between the WORLD 2008 and the one that will end tomorrow.
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