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Company and PhilosophyIndependence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

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Christophe
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Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Christophe » 27/10/17, 16:02

Waaw I did not think it would happen ... Catalonia is a new "country" European?

Basque, Corsican, Alsatian, Bretons, Ardennais, Picards, Savoyards ... Wake up! : Mrgreen: : Mrgreen:

Attention she already had a lot of autonomy in fact (from 1932 according to Wiki): https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalogne

Live: the Catalan Parliament begins the process of independence

The resolution committing a "constituent process" to separate from Spain was passed Friday by 70 votes for, 10 against, 2 blanks. 53 deputies had left the hemicycle before the vote.

(...)


Press and direct:

http://www.lemonde.fr/europe/live/2017/ ... _3214.html

http://www.francetvinfo.fr/monde/espagn ... 39737.html

http://www.lci.fr/international/en-dire ... 67791.html
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Did67 » 27/10/17, 16:44

Christophe wrote:
Catalonia is a new European "country"?



They can declare themselves.

The Spanish State will put them under guardianship (Article 155). So, legally, take the power.

After that, what? Civil war ???

I do not know.

European, in the sense of the continent, perhaps, they can become - if it does not turn to civil war.

EU membership, on the other hand, will take years and years ... probably a dozen or so, like the fastest Baltic countries (Estonia). Probably more because, contrary to the unanimous desire to "hang up" Eastern European countries before Putin gets their hands on them, no EU country will want this to succeed in the case of Catalonia, to prevent this from giving ideas to their "minorities". And there is everywhere! That will quibble dry! Maybe never succeed even!

In my opinion, it will quickly decline! In particular, French companies looking for a "pied à terre" in Spain often fell back on Catalonia, culturally and geographically close. They will go to other Spanish regions.

But hey, a "country" can choose to be autonomous and ... poor, or declining, or landlocked! This is his strictest right.

Finished, the Leonardo in Barcelona, ​​too.
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Christophe » 27/10/17, 17:01

Did67 wrote:After that, Civil War ???

I do not know.


Maybe, we already had a taste of violence from the "central" government during the referendum ...

And this Spanish split is likely to give ideas to Flemish ... well not ideas but reasons to put it because it's been years that some want, we even talked about it in 2006: media / the-belgium-a-exploding-debate-on-the-power-of-media-t2758.html

Review the famous docu-fiction that scared many Belgians: https://www.econologie.com/telechargeme ... n-realite/

Yes, let's not forget that the Belgium is currently led by the NVa, that is to say the extreme right Flemish ... and yes we speak very little but Belgium is on the far right ...
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Gaston » 27/10/17, 17:21

As a comparison of the methods used elsewhere, I advise the reading of this article.
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Did67 » 27/10/17, 18:12

One of the questions is that of the scale at which we take a "democratic" decision ...

Is Spain as a State in favor of the independence of Catalonia? I do not think so. I'm talking about the people, not the representatives. The representation posing to the democracies another problem still!

But assuming that Catalonia democratically votes for independence (because there is far from unanimity, the sham election does not answer), is it possible that such a common your then against and stay in Spain ??? For if the national vote does not impose itself on Catalonia, why would the Catalan vote, if it were to be for independence, impose itself on the communes?

Where we see that democracy is complicated.
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Did67 » 27/10/17, 18:15

Christophe wrote:
Maybe, we already had a taste of violence from the "central" government during the referendum ...



I only half joke with the idea of ​​civil war!

It is clear that Madrid played biceps, hoping to dissuade the separatists ... At least the majority of the population. But they lacked finesse.
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Christophe » 28/10/17, 01:02

What makes me laugh is that we are witnessing more and more the regionalization of Nations ... everywhere in Europe ...

Nations that have federated, often for centuries, these regions to exist and this quite frequently in blood and violence ...

In short, I have a little feeling of going back there ...

Can we predict the end of nations and the emergence of federated regions? Perhaps...
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Did67 » 28/10/17, 09:54

I see it as a form of nationalism on a smaller scale. On the right, far right or extreme left, this remains "nationalism" (in the sense rejection of the other).

It is the refusal to "cooperate" and to share, refusal to build things, refusal of socialization, thus refusal of civilization ... It is the temptation to think that the "problems", it always comes from first of all!

At the end of the end, everyone in his hole and we will be happy?

Because from the nation to the region - Catalonia über alles - we will go to the cities - Strasbourg über alles - then to the districts - the Robertsau über alles - then to this building - the 36 über alles ... And so at the end of the end, everyone in his hole. Like rats.

In another register, it is communitarianism. Philosophically, it's the same.

I think it's currently a "heavy trend". After "disillusions" related to excesses of "socialization" or its abuses (social security, APL, ASSEDIC ...).

Take that for a jerk. Not objective.
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby Ahmed » 28/10/17, 10:15

Why speak of excess of "socialization" (which was rather the sign of the opposite, but I noted your parenthesis), while it is obviously the passage from the selection R to the selection k (as it would say, quite rightly Sen-no-sen)?
This development can only reinforce the imbalances between the regions and provoke increasing tensions.
In social matters, we are not left with the highlighting of this old absurd concept of "run-off", which consists in favoring the richest minority, a technique that guarantees a consequence that is not observed in the physical world. summoned by this metaphor: run-off to the top ...
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Re: Independence of Catalonia this 27 October 2017

Unread Messageby izentrop » 28/10/17, 10:59

Communitarianism, nationalism ...

"The most radical Catalan separatists have won, precipitating Spain in chaos," judge Alexandra Schwartzbrod. "Passion has taken over and we do not see how the worst can be avoided", analyzes the editorialist of Libération.

It is important for all actors to keep in mind examples from the past, even recent ones https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guerre_de ... 3%A9govine
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